Will the APX ever offer TRUE multi-band across ALL bands ?

This forum is dedicated to discussions pertaining specifically to the Motorola ASTRO line of radios (those that use VSELP/IMBE/AMBE), including using digital modulation, digital programming, FlashPort upgrades, etc. If you have general questions please use the General or Programming forums.

Moderator: Queue Moderator

Post Reply
MT2000 man
Posts: 1307
Joined: Tue Sep 04, 2001 4:00 pm
What radios do you own?: XTS5000R, Astro Saber III, I

Will the APX ever offer TRUE multi-band across ALL bands ?

Post by MT2000 man »

The APX has been out since 2009(ish) and to my knowledge ( at least reading around here ) there has been no mention of an APX that can do ALL bands ( ie- 800/700, UHF, VHF ) in one radio, not JUST being limited on picking only two of the said bands.

Anyone know if this will be coming out anytime soon, or will the APX only ever offer a "pick two" of the different bands ?
User avatar
Tom in D.C.
Posts: 3859
Joined: Tue Sep 04, 2001 4:00 pm
What radios do you own?: Progreso soup can with CRT

Re: Will the APX ever offer TRUE multi-band across ALL bands

Post by Tom in D.C. »

Motorola, for its own reasons, decided to offer the APX 7000 as a "two out of three" bands model. You want three bands you're forced to use Thales, Harris, Daniels, or Datron (more possibly?). I wouldn't bet on there being a Motorola tribander any time soon but, then again, who knows the future?
Tom in D.C.
In 1920, the U.S. Post Office Department ruled
that children may not be sent by parcel post.
MT2000 man
Posts: 1307
Joined: Tue Sep 04, 2001 4:00 pm
What radios do you own?: XTS5000R, Astro Saber III, I

Re: Will the APX ever offer TRUE multi-band across ALL bands

Post by MT2000 man »

Thanks for the fast response Tom !

I kinda figured Motorola was set in thier ways of not having an APX do ALL the bands in one radio any time soon :(

Oh well, hope you had a great Christmas !

Mike
User avatar
Tom in D.C.
Posts: 3859
Joined: Tue Sep 04, 2001 4:00 pm
What radios do you own?: Progreso soup can with CRT

Re: Will the APX ever offer TRUE multi-band across ALL bands

Post by Tom in D.C. »

Mike,

Thanks for the good wishes. We had a quiet day at home and hope you had a good Christmas as well.

In theory, you could say that the 7K is a five-band radio (VHF, UHF-R1, UHF-R2, 700, and 800 mHz) but
you only get to use two of the five bands! Of course the "five-band" claim is sort of stretching the truth
but would look good in an ad, I guess. When the 7K was originally announced it was to be a UHF/800 radio
only; the VHF capability was added later on, but either way it is what it is and since I don't have any legal
use for 800 I'm glad to have my V/U radio. It is definitely a super performer.

Regards,
Tom in D.C.
In 1920, the U.S. Post Office Department ruled
that children may not be sent by parcel post.
haukenes
New User
Posts: 3
Joined: Tue Oct 13, 2009 5:29 pm

Re: Will the APX ever offer TRUE multi-band across ALL bands

Post by haukenes »

Yeah, i don't see a true multiband portable coming out of Motorola anytime soon... as is the APX line suffers from desense problems because their Front End Filter has to be pretty much left wide open to support dual band radios, i'd see that getting worse if you continued to add additional bands in there; and soemthing tells me that Mother Moto isn't willing to release a public safety radio no no front end filtering to speak of...

Its a shame though, i'd love the ability to wander around wherever i needed to...
-Motorola Service Technician 2005-Present-
User avatar
MSS-Dave
Posts: 770
Joined: Mon Jun 30, 2003 6:02 pm
What radios do you own?: XTL5K, NX300, PD782, Spark Gap

Re: Will the APX ever offer TRUE multi-band across ALL bands

Post by MSS-Dave »

haukenes wrote:Yeah, i don't see a true multiband portable coming out of Motorola anytime soon... as is the APX line suffers from desense problems because their Front End Filter has to be pretty much left wide open to support dual band radios, i'd see that getting worse if you continued to add additional bands in there; and soemthing tells me that Mother Moto isn't willing to release a public safety radio no no front end filtering to speak of...

Its a shame though, i'd love the ability to wander around wherever i needed to...
HUH? I've never had any problem with my UHF R1/7-800 radio desensing on either band. I'm talking about standing close to an antenna on a rooftop (either band) and being able to hear other repeater channels miles away from this site.

Can you elaborate?

Dave
Jim202
Posts: 3609
Joined: Sun Sep 09, 2001 4:00 pm

Re: Will the APX ever offer TRUE multi-band across ALL bands

Post by Jim202 »

I haven't seen any multi band radio come out from any of the vendors that is a true interoperability radio. The bottom line that the sales force will tap dance around all day long is that they won't tell you there is only one receiver in these radios. What this means is that you can set up the scan list to look at what ever channels you want in either of the 2 bands. What happens is when the first channel with RF pops up, the scan stops. Stays on that channel till the RF drops. Any radio chatter on the other band is lost.

So if your at an incident with activity on both bands that you need to listen to, your SOL. The solution is just what we have done for years. Use 2 radios. With the cost of the multi band radios, agencies are taking a real hard look at the cost and in many cases staying with 2 radios to solve the problem.

Until the vendors come up with a true multi band radio that has 2 receivers, the interoperability problem will not be resolved. The cost of these radios needs to come into line with other radios when you can buy 2, 3 or even 4 single band radios depending on features, for the price of one of these toys.

Jim
Jim1348
Posts: 542
Joined: Sun Aug 15, 2004 7:52 am

Will The APX Ever Offer TRUE Multi-Band Across ALL Bands?

Post by Jim1348 »

Jim (And The Group),

You make some excellent points. I was a deputy sheriff until retiring at the end of 2010. When I started police work it was almost ALL VHF analog conventional. As much as I enjoyed high channel capacity scanning on ONE band, sometimes the old adage "more is less" applied. For example, the last VHF mobile I had was a hand me down GE Delta with a S-950/990 control head. I had it set up in 4 modes of 32 channels each. I seem to recall it may have even had dual level priority. These are great features. Despite all of that, however, there were times I would take my Motorola HT1000 or even my Yaesu FT-8800 and simply park, not scan, on a SINGLE channel. There are times where multiple channels are involved and you simply have to do that. If a pursuit was involved we used MINSEF (NLEEF), but State Patrol might also have critical communications of their channel related to the event, etc.

Fast forward to our area going to an 800 mHz digital, trunked simulcast system. The "powers that be" decided that since I had an unmarked and was not on patrol that I did not need a mobile radio and only gave me a Motorola XTS5000 with a Converta Com. For some deputies we never scanned talkgroups it was probably fine. I scanned as many as I could, but I had to supplement with a Uniden Bearcat scanner. Since I worked with a lot of the city PDs, it was very helpful to be able to scan their city wide and tactical talkgroups. Not to mention the large number of law enforcement, fire, emergency medical, and other mutual aid talkgroups.

I guess from my perspective using a portable is always something of a compromise. It seems like it is NEVER as good as using a genuine mobile radio in the vehicle. (And, of course, using a mobile isn't as good as being at a fixed station!) I don't know that many people here will agree with this, but in many cases, at least "back in the day" a portable radio would get you by until you could get to your mobile radio. In sort of a weird way it is sort of like being armed only with a semi-automatic pistol, it will get you by until you can get to your rifle! Actually I guess the old saying is "A handgun is for shooting your way to your rifle..."

Jim
User avatar
007
Posts: 1546
Joined: Sat Nov 23, 2002 5:22 am
What radios do you own?: W7 FPP lowband MaraTrac w/AES

Re: Will the APX ever offer TRUE multi-band across ALL bands

Post by 007 »

MSS-Dave wrote:
haukenes wrote:Yeah, i don't see a true multiband portable coming out of Motorola anytime soon... as is the APX line suffers from desense problems because their Front End Filter has to be pretty much left wide open to support dual band radios, i'd see that getting worse if you continued to add additional bands in there; and soemthing tells me that Mother Moto isn't willing to release a public safety radio no no front end filtering to speak of...

Its a shame though, i'd love the ability to wander around wherever i needed to...
HUH? I've never had any problem with my UHF R1/7-800 radio desensing on either band. I'm talking about standing close to an antenna on a rooftop (either band) and being able to hear other repeater channels miles away from this site.

Can you elaborate?

Dave
Through various testing that has been done before radios allowed to operate on trunked systems I am familiar with, it has been found that some of the multi-band radios do suffer from desense. One of systems will not allow the Harris Unity because of internal desense issues and another system almost didn't allow the Harris Unity or a dual band APX because of those same issues.
Do not make Sig angry...he'll just keep ringing the bell.
User avatar
batdude
Personal aide to Mr. Cook
Posts: 2741
Joined: Thu Oct 04, 2001 4:00 pm

Re: Will the APX ever offer TRUE multi-band across ALL bands

Post by batdude »

were these formal reports or just some testing?


i'd like to see the OQE --- seriously --- and not as a moto defender either.... just curious how the testing was done and under what conditions...



doug
BRAVO MIKE JULIET ALPHA
"You can do whatever you want, there are just consequences..."
IF SOMEONE PM'S YOU - HAVE THE COURTESY TO REPLY.
Post Reply

Return to “Legacy Batboard Motorola ASTRO (VSELP/IMBE/AMBE) Equipment Forum”