My dept received today from Mot an estimate on the price of a new astro system. Three items were listed--
Two Quantar repeaters (one main, one backup)
DES-OFB
2 CentraCom Gold Elite 21" consoles
Cost....
$110,000 (and add in 6% incidentals, enginnering costs etc)
That price is before replacing around 15 mobiles and 25 portables..
Gotta love it.
<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Pj on 2002-01-14 01:43 ]</font>
The cost of a SMALL astro system
Moderator: Queue Moderator
-
/\/\y 2 cents
- On Moderation
- Posts: 851
- Joined: Sun Nov 11, 2001 4:00 pm
- What radios do you own?: iPhone, Blackberry, HT220
this is for a conventional system so there is no trunked controller or anything fancy....I would believe this would be about right for the repeaters (2) and nothing else....a better figure would be more like $750,000 with 4 channels and smartnet...kinda like a ASTRO startsite system. Is your department looking to make a serious change? or are they just shopping around? Make sure they quoted you a true ASTRO CAI system and not one that is just "capible" or upgradeable because you are buying quantars.
We are looking to make an actual switch over, but with the politics of a small town, it may not be as soon as we like. We are looking to switch over to a digital system, Astro Spectras and XTS-3000/3500 (3500 if I get my way, since the Astro Sabers will be disc soon).
My theroy is to get everyone in town (depts) on board, and share the cost, so we look a little better. We currently run an 8 channel Centracom II/MSF5000 system, with many extra's on the console that will have to be cut over.
My theroy is to get everyone in town (depts) on board, and share the cost, so we look a little better. We currently run an 8 channel Centracom II/MSF5000 system, with many extra's on the console that will have to be cut over.
-
/\/\y 2 cents
- On Moderation
- Posts: 851
- Joined: Sun Nov 11, 2001 4:00 pm
- What radios do you own?: iPhone, Blackberry, HT220
What Band are you currently using, And what band do you want to move to? If you do not plan on moving bands, then when do you intend to go about filing to upgrade your license to digital status? Has your department hired an outside advisor and consultant or are you dealing only with the Motorola guys? I run a private consulting firm and have pretty good experience with public safety. Would love to help and give you some insight and advisement if the county is seriously considering making a move. Private mesage me if you would like to talk.
-
Elroy Jetson
- Posts: 1158
- Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2001 4:00 pm
Have your department contact the State of Florida. They're going to be scrapping their Astro system (and it's up-to-date) for a POS Ma-Com/Comnet-Ericsson/Ge garbage system which will be less reliable, have shorter range, and be easier to monitor. Good job, f@!kheads in the DMS! (Department of Managerial Services)
They'll have PLENTY of equipment that could be re-utilized in an Astro system of virtually any size.
Elroy
They'll have PLENTY of equipment that could be re-utilized in an Astro system of virtually any size.
Elroy
-
/\/\y 2 cents
- On Moderation
- Posts: 851
- Joined: Sun Nov 11, 2001 4:00 pm
- What radios do you own?: iPhone, Blackberry, HT220
Watch what you say about that Ma/Com system! The company is run by TYCO and TYCO rarely loses...look at their stock performance compared to Motorola. It may not be as "cool" and have the appeal that the motorola one has, but if it works and is cheaper is all that is asked. I'd be willing to bet that TYCO turns things around. All they do in business is aquistions and turnarounds, and they are extremely sucessful at that, and that is what this system is exactly, system an aquisition and turnaround
-
/\/\y 2 cents
- On Moderation
- Posts: 851
- Joined: Sun Nov 11, 2001 4:00 pm
- What radios do you own?: iPhone, Blackberry, HT220
-
Elroy Jetson
- Posts: 1158
- Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2001 4:00 pm
Yeah, but they're dealing with a legacy technology that isn't necessarily up to genuinely competitive levels with Motorola. I don't think they offer an APCO Project 25, AKA EIA/TIA 102 compliant solution, or certainly they did NOT as of a few months ago.
If Tyco/Macom turns out to be a tough competitor, that'd be the wake-up call that Motorola needs to get their heads out of their butts and start kicking out some good product and world-class support for it as well. Adapt or die. That should apply to Motorola, too.
This may be just what Motorola needs to regain their edge.
Elroy
If Tyco/Macom turns out to be a tough competitor, that'd be the wake-up call that Motorola needs to get their heads out of their butts and start kicking out some good product and world-class support for it as well. Adapt or die. That should apply to Motorola, too.
This may be just what Motorola needs to regain their edge.
Elroy
Elroy may be right - some real competition may be just what Motorola needs.
As to Tyco - sure they are big - but how big is their 2-way operation? The article in MRT when Commnet bough EGE said they had 700+ employees. Add to that the two way MaCom staff and how does that compare to Motorola???
Another thing about Tyco - they don't like to loose money. How long will they give MaCom to get on track? Sure - they got Florida (there are a lot of opinions as to just what Commnet did to make that happen) but they don't have it working completely yet. The sheer size of the thing has to be a challange for the old EDACS format - so look for them to develop a type II trunking that supports lots more ID's & talkgroups. That will cost them plenty.
There are also opinions that the Opensky system in PA is not rolling out on schedule either - the sales guys are talking about 4-to-1 TDMA but they haven't even got the 2-to-1 up yet.
The MaCom guys are saying Tyco put in 500 million or so to jump start the new operation - so how long until they demand results?? There's a lot of engineering to make all this work and when they get there where will the market be? They lost South Dakota and Nebraska to Motorola and even lost the EDACS home state of VA because they don't have narrow-band high-band digital.
Also look for them to 'invent' C4FM in order to be narrow-band. They already use the IMBE vocoder as Provoice - but they won't sign up to APCO25. When they combine C4FM and IMBE look for them to tout some magically better error correction as why they are better than APCO25 when in fact they will really be validating it!
As to Tyco - sure they are big - but how big is their 2-way operation? The article in MRT when Commnet bough EGE said they had 700+ employees. Add to that the two way MaCom staff and how does that compare to Motorola???
Another thing about Tyco - they don't like to loose money. How long will they give MaCom to get on track? Sure - they got Florida (there are a lot of opinions as to just what Commnet did to make that happen) but they don't have it working completely yet. The sheer size of the thing has to be a challange for the old EDACS format - so look for them to develop a type II trunking that supports lots more ID's & talkgroups. That will cost them plenty.
There are also opinions that the Opensky system in PA is not rolling out on schedule either - the sales guys are talking about 4-to-1 TDMA but they haven't even got the 2-to-1 up yet.
The MaCom guys are saying Tyco put in 500 million or so to jump start the new operation - so how long until they demand results?? There's a lot of engineering to make all this work and when they get there where will the market be? They lost South Dakota and Nebraska to Motorola and even lost the EDACS home state of VA because they don't have narrow-band high-band digital.
Also look for them to 'invent' C4FM in order to be narrow-band. They already use the IMBE vocoder as Provoice - but they won't sign up to APCO25. When they combine C4FM and IMBE look for them to tout some magically better error correction as why they are better than APCO25 when in fact they will really be validating it!
-
Elroy Jetson
- Posts: 1158
- Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2001 4:00 pm
This is interesting news. I didn't know about those systems that Motorola won over like Nebraska. Good for Da Big M!
As you said, Tyco doesn't like to lose money. If they can't make their shiny new (used) radio group profitable in a certain time, they'll give it the axe. They're into money, not doing cool stuff in a limited market that DOESN'T make money.
Motorola seems to be (at least in the past) more adventurous and willing to take risks. Witness the Iridium concept. A two billion dollar bath.
Now they've downsized fifty thousand people in the past two years?
Maybe I should make Motorola an offer: For twenty percent of the usual salary of a high-ranking mugwump with the authority to make decisions on products and marketing, I'll take the job for one year. If I enhance sales and service and turn the division around, they pay me the remaining 80 percent of the usual salary as a bonus, and keep me on. If the division doesn't turn around, they can let me go and hire somebody else, having saved 80 percent on the usual paycheck and having achieved par-for-the-course results.
If I ran that zoo, here's what I'd do:
Order developement of a new radio that would be a greatly upgraded version of the Astro Saber, with similar design and ergonomics, and legacy compatibility with all accessories, along with new miniature, high capacity batteries to reduce overall size.
Discontinue the current Astro Saber line when the replacement is ready.
Move the XTS line into a lower tier at reduced cost.
Axe many models and even entire radio series,
making the product line less confusing and more tightly focused on their markets. Renew the emphasis on simplicity and reliability.
This by itself will reduce costs substantially. Maintaining seven production lines, tooling, and inventory is much less expensive than maintaining 21 lines.
Lower costs substantially, even dramatically.
Develop a marketing strategy where large radio systems are sold at nearly COST, with built-in maintenance and service contracts that provide the profit margin.
Develop a marketing strategy that is based on placing unsolicited bids (at lowball prices) to upgrade or replace systems that are the subject of a lot of complaints from users, regardless of manufacturer. Support the competitor's products.
Stop trying to push digital as the wave of the future until field tests show that it actually DOES perform better than analog.
Start selling systems in frequency ranges that are appropriate to the environment. No 800 systems in the mountains! Low band trunking! UHF and VHF are best for most cities anyway.
Entirely drop the 'level three license' concept for RSS. You want the software, it's fifty bucks for any title. Call and order it, no account necessary.
Drop the enhanced security on newer software. Everybody knows that the harder it is to crack, the more certain it is that somebody will crack the software.
Order a true 'receive only' trunking mode added to every radio and all software, with no system key requirements. A 'super scanner' mode.
Maybe I should fly to Schaumberg and offer my services....?
Elroy
As you said, Tyco doesn't like to lose money. If they can't make their shiny new (used) radio group profitable in a certain time, they'll give it the axe. They're into money, not doing cool stuff in a limited market that DOESN'T make money.
Motorola seems to be (at least in the past) more adventurous and willing to take risks. Witness the Iridium concept. A two billion dollar bath.
Now they've downsized fifty thousand people in the past two years?
Maybe I should make Motorola an offer: For twenty percent of the usual salary of a high-ranking mugwump with the authority to make decisions on products and marketing, I'll take the job for one year. If I enhance sales and service and turn the division around, they pay me the remaining 80 percent of the usual salary as a bonus, and keep me on. If the division doesn't turn around, they can let me go and hire somebody else, having saved 80 percent on the usual paycheck and having achieved par-for-the-course results.
If I ran that zoo, here's what I'd do:
Order developement of a new radio that would be a greatly upgraded version of the Astro Saber, with similar design and ergonomics, and legacy compatibility with all accessories, along with new miniature, high capacity batteries to reduce overall size.
Discontinue the current Astro Saber line when the replacement is ready.
Move the XTS line into a lower tier at reduced cost.
Axe many models and even entire radio series,
making the product line less confusing and more tightly focused on their markets. Renew the emphasis on simplicity and reliability.
This by itself will reduce costs substantially. Maintaining seven production lines, tooling, and inventory is much less expensive than maintaining 21 lines.
Lower costs substantially, even dramatically.
Develop a marketing strategy where large radio systems are sold at nearly COST, with built-in maintenance and service contracts that provide the profit margin.
Develop a marketing strategy that is based on placing unsolicited bids (at lowball prices) to upgrade or replace systems that are the subject of a lot of complaints from users, regardless of manufacturer. Support the competitor's products.
Stop trying to push digital as the wave of the future until field tests show that it actually DOES perform better than analog.
Start selling systems in frequency ranges that are appropriate to the environment. No 800 systems in the mountains! Low band trunking! UHF and VHF are best for most cities anyway.
Entirely drop the 'level three license' concept for RSS. You want the software, it's fifty bucks for any title. Call and order it, no account necessary.
Drop the enhanced security on newer software. Everybody knows that the harder it is to crack, the more certain it is that somebody will crack the software.
Order a true 'receive only' trunking mode added to every radio and all software, with no system key requirements. A 'super scanner' mode.
Maybe I should fly to Schaumberg and offer my services....?
Elroy
Elroy - you refered to a smaller Saber battery - "along with new miniature, high capacity batteries to reduce overall size."
I believe there is a new Lithium-Ion Saber battery that is the size of the little NTN4592 but with the capacity of the big NTN4595. I saw it as a purchase option on an Astro Saber price sheet (at $255.00!), but there was no part number listed - just an option order number (one of those Hxxx #'s).
I think our EM guy got a flyer on it and ordered one, but it is on back order - I'll try to get the # from him.
I believe there is a new Lithium-Ion Saber battery that is the size of the little NTN4592 but with the capacity of the big NTN4595. I saw it as a purchase option on an Astro Saber price sheet (at $255.00!), but there was no part number listed - just an option order number (one of those Hxxx #'s).
I think our EM guy got a flyer on it and ordered one, but it is on back order - I'll try to get the # from him.
BRAVO ELROY!!!!!!!!!!
Hopefully one of the motorola "people" who read this board will print and copy your thread and "maybe" or rather "if so happens" that you get a call,,,,,You're in.........
Just remember us here, when it comes time to test pilot the new re-vamped astro saber series radios.
Free Flash codes for all!!!!!!!!!
Hopefully one of the motorola "people" who read this board will print and copy your thread and "maybe" or rather "if so happens" that you get a call,,,,,You're in.........
Just remember us here, when it comes time to test pilot the new re-vamped astro saber series radios.
Free Flash codes for all!!!!!!!!!
-
Elroy Jetson
- Posts: 1158
- Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2001 4:00 pm
In such an unlikely event that I got picked up, be assured I'd be looking for volunteers to field-test the new products in a variety of configurations and under varying service conditions. Such developmental prototype radios would be issued and accountable for the duration of the test runs, at the conclusion of which the holders of those radios would be compensated for their services or would be permitted to keep the product, with guaranteed no-cost upgrades and repairs for the service lifespan of the product, which should be at least ten years.
Elroy
Elroy
my .02
As you said, Tyco doesn't like to lose money. If they can't make their shiny new (used) radio group profitable in a certain time, they'll give it the axe. They're into money, not doing cool stuff in a limited market that DOESN'T make money.
>>> right on target.
Motorola seems to be (at least in the past) more adventurous and willing to take risks. Witness the Iridium concept. A two billion dollar bath.
>>> a well calculated tax break. How else to write off BILLIONS of dollars in R&D, and still end up as the sole source for end user gear...a la NEXT-HELL.
Now they've downsized fifty thousand people in the past two years?
>>> FAT TRIMMING, unfortunately, that lazy, 50+ year old guy *DOES* have lots of experience that you lose... witness the PARTS ID line nowadays... can u say "CLUELESS"?
Maybe I should make Motorola an offer: For twenty percent of the usual salary of a high-ranking mugwump with the authority to make decisions on products and marketing, I'll take the job for one year. If I enhance sales and service and turn the division around, they pay me the remaining 80 percent of the usual salary as a bonus, and keep me on. If the division doesn't turn around, they can let me go and hire somebody else, having saved 80 percent on the usual paycheck and having achieved par-for-the-course results.
>>> i'm sure any number of us could provide this service...we'd spend all day saying "IDIOT" and "JACKASS"...
Order developement of a new radio that would be a greatly upgraded version of the Astro Saber, with similar design and ergonomics, and legacy compatibility with all accessories, along with new miniature, high capacity batteries to reduce overall size.
Discontinue the current Astro Saber line when the replacement is ready.
>>> #1 problem with astro saber is COST. Too expensive to make, and that price is passed on to the user. the products you describe already exist as the XTS-5000... problem is ... it's TOO advanced!
Move the XTS line into a lower tier at reduced cost. Axe many models and even entire radio series, making the product line less confusing and more tightly focused on their markets. Renew the emphasis on simplicity and reliability.
>>> Dead on.
This by itself will reduce costs substantially. Maintaining seven production lines, tooling, and inventory is much less expensive than maintaining 21 lines.
>>> i'd have three lines of radios, low, middle and high.. and about 3 models coming off each line.
Lower costs substantially, even dramatically.
>>> back to that "axe 50,000 people" thing...plus this is a reliability vs. cost question... M has always had the best Accelerated Life Test program in the industry... and they have more radios that meet mil-spec than anyone else...
Develop a marketing strategy where large radio systems are sold at nearly COST, with built-in maintenance and service contracts that provide the profit margin.
>>> already doing that...if they would have done florida that way, they'd still be a customer...
Develop a marketing strategy that is based on placing unsolicited bids (at lowball prices) to upgrade or replace systems that are the subject of a lot of complaints from users, regardless of manufacturer. Support the competitor's products.
>>> oil and water. MA/COM is not going to license SMARTNET/SMARTZONE and i would be they are not going to offer a P25 solution either...nor is M going to license anything from MA/COM or OpenSky... they (MA/COM) feel as though they can gap the market with some other solution ...
Stop trying to push digital as the wave of the future until field tests show that it actually DOES perform better than analog.
>>>operator training is #1 problem...digital *IS* different than plain jane 5khz FM...
Start selling systems in frequency ranges that are appropriate to the environment. No 800 systems in the mountains! Low band trunking! UHF and VHF are best for most cities anyway.
>>> any freq range can work anywhere, just depends on how much $$$ you want to spend!
Entirely drop the 'level three license' concept for RSS. You want the software, it's fifty bucks for any title. Call and order it, no account necessary.
>>> great idea, will never happen. remember, the MSS is what made M land mobile what it "IS" (was)... and that dealer is still the outlet for 60% of the radios coming out of the plants...no way they are going to end-user the software at cheap prices and cut the MSS outta the loop.
Drop the enhanced security on newer software. Everybody knows that the harder it is to crack, the more certain it is that somebody will crack the software.
>>> ???? what security? dynamic link library (windows) software???
Order a true 'receive only' trunking mode added to every radio and all software, with no system key requirements. A 'super scanner' mode.
>>>yes, sell the user a radio system and offer a product that will allow joe blow the ability to listen? conflict of interest!
i've thought for years how a limited UHF (2w) and 800 radio would sell...imagine being able to utilize UHF and 800 in a single chassis! but...
why sell one radio, when you can sell two...
get the idea?
doug
As you said, Tyco doesn't like to lose money. If they can't make their shiny new (used) radio group profitable in a certain time, they'll give it the axe. They're into money, not doing cool stuff in a limited market that DOESN'T make money.
>>> right on target.
Motorola seems to be (at least in the past) more adventurous and willing to take risks. Witness the Iridium concept. A two billion dollar bath.
>>> a well calculated tax break. How else to write off BILLIONS of dollars in R&D, and still end up as the sole source for end user gear...a la NEXT-HELL.
Now they've downsized fifty thousand people in the past two years?
>>> FAT TRIMMING, unfortunately, that lazy, 50+ year old guy *DOES* have lots of experience that you lose... witness the PARTS ID line nowadays... can u say "CLUELESS"?
Maybe I should make Motorola an offer: For twenty percent of the usual salary of a high-ranking mugwump with the authority to make decisions on products and marketing, I'll take the job for one year. If I enhance sales and service and turn the division around, they pay me the remaining 80 percent of the usual salary as a bonus, and keep me on. If the division doesn't turn around, they can let me go and hire somebody else, having saved 80 percent on the usual paycheck and having achieved par-for-the-course results.
>>> i'm sure any number of us could provide this service...we'd spend all day saying "IDIOT" and "JACKASS"...
Order developement of a new radio that would be a greatly upgraded version of the Astro Saber, with similar design and ergonomics, and legacy compatibility with all accessories, along with new miniature, high capacity batteries to reduce overall size.
Discontinue the current Astro Saber line when the replacement is ready.
>>> #1 problem with astro saber is COST. Too expensive to make, and that price is passed on to the user. the products you describe already exist as the XTS-5000... problem is ... it's TOO advanced!
Move the XTS line into a lower tier at reduced cost. Axe many models and even entire radio series, making the product line less confusing and more tightly focused on their markets. Renew the emphasis on simplicity and reliability.
>>> Dead on.
This by itself will reduce costs substantially. Maintaining seven production lines, tooling, and inventory is much less expensive than maintaining 21 lines.
>>> i'd have three lines of radios, low, middle and high.. and about 3 models coming off each line.
Lower costs substantially, even dramatically.
>>> back to that "axe 50,000 people" thing...plus this is a reliability vs. cost question... M has always had the best Accelerated Life Test program in the industry... and they have more radios that meet mil-spec than anyone else...
Develop a marketing strategy where large radio systems are sold at nearly COST, with built-in maintenance and service contracts that provide the profit margin.
>>> already doing that...if they would have done florida that way, they'd still be a customer...
Develop a marketing strategy that is based on placing unsolicited bids (at lowball prices) to upgrade or replace systems that are the subject of a lot of complaints from users, regardless of manufacturer. Support the competitor's products.
>>> oil and water. MA/COM is not going to license SMARTNET/SMARTZONE and i would be they are not going to offer a P25 solution either...nor is M going to license anything from MA/COM or OpenSky... they (MA/COM) feel as though they can gap the market with some other solution ...
Stop trying to push digital as the wave of the future until field tests show that it actually DOES perform better than analog.
>>>operator training is #1 problem...digital *IS* different than plain jane 5khz FM...
Start selling systems in frequency ranges that are appropriate to the environment. No 800 systems in the mountains! Low band trunking! UHF and VHF are best for most cities anyway.
>>> any freq range can work anywhere, just depends on how much $$$ you want to spend!
Entirely drop the 'level three license' concept for RSS. You want the software, it's fifty bucks for any title. Call and order it, no account necessary.
>>> great idea, will never happen. remember, the MSS is what made M land mobile what it "IS" (was)... and that dealer is still the outlet for 60% of the radios coming out of the plants...no way they are going to end-user the software at cheap prices and cut the MSS outta the loop.
Drop the enhanced security on newer software. Everybody knows that the harder it is to crack, the more certain it is that somebody will crack the software.
>>> ???? what security? dynamic link library (windows) software???
Order a true 'receive only' trunking mode added to every radio and all software, with no system key requirements. A 'super scanner' mode.
>>>yes, sell the user a radio system and offer a product that will allow joe blow the ability to listen? conflict of interest!
i've thought for years how a limited UHF (2w) and 800 radio would sell...imagine being able to utilize UHF and 800 in a single chassis! but...
why sell one radio, when you can sell two...
get the idea?
doug
Pj.....
I can't suggest strongly enough that you scrap your plans for digital upgrade. Check with NYFD since they spent almost 5 million and then went back to analog after one of the firefighters almost lost his life due to the system. NYFD experimented and found the same problem. Also ask ANY LAPD street officer what they think about the "upgrade" to digital. It "works" so badly that they went so far as to take away all simplex (talkaround) capability on repeater channels. The "fix" for this was to add seperate "simplex" channels on a different freq and you have to scan the base freq.
Some simple internet research will yield a wealth of negative input about the digital system. It DOES work great when only two radios are trying to communicate. The problem comes when more than 1 signal at a time is recieved. Analog radios just hear the strongest signal. Digital radios mix the signal and you get "honking" or nothing at all.
I do own an Astro and use it everyday, I just long for the days when I was on the analog system.
I can't suggest strongly enough that you scrap your plans for digital upgrade. Check with NYFD since they spent almost 5 million and then went back to analog after one of the firefighters almost lost his life due to the system. NYFD experimented and found the same problem. Also ask ANY LAPD street officer what they think about the "upgrade" to digital. It "works" so badly that they went so far as to take away all simplex (talkaround) capability on repeater channels. The "fix" for this was to add seperate "simplex" channels on a different freq and you have to scan the base freq.
Some simple internet research will yield a wealth of negative input about the digital system. It DOES work great when only two radios are trying to communicate. The problem comes when more than 1 signal at a time is recieved. Analog radios just hear the strongest signal. Digital radios mix the signal and you get "honking" or nothing at all.
I do own an Astro and use it everyday, I just long for the days when I was on the analog system.
-
Astro_Saber
- Fail 01/90
- Posts: 837
- Joined: Wed Sep 05, 2001 4:00 pm
-
aaron_tech
- Posts: 76
- Joined: Sat Sep 29, 2001 4:00 pm
I work for a MSS in Virginia and I have a far amount of experience with both EDACS and Astro(trunked and conventional) I have been to factory training on both systems. The fact of the matter is that neither company should be pushing digital communication solutions for public service. The astro system and the mayco/com-net/ge both have unexplainable problems that techs can't fix. The system get out of sync and if you know anything about digital you know what that does to your comm. The best system I have seen that is new and effective is conventional simulcast. The digital technology is not strong enough yet!!!! Its getting there but It ain't yet. Now for all those people out there that say ask the LAPDor NYFD or DCFD how good their systems worked I submit this. The wash DC FD was qouted over 28 recieve sites to support there astro system. The district couldn't afford it and only put in around 10 can you tell me why they have a coverage problem. To many people are to quick to blame motorola or macomm but there are always 2 sides to every story.
My 2 cents
Aaron
My 2 cents
Aaron
Couldn't agree with you more. If you are going for a new radio system, make sure you buy the infrastruce. I don't know if it was in this post or another, but CSP did just that. They have a statewide 800 Astro Smartzone system with almost 99% coverage, and no major problems. All the troopers that I have talked to love it.
If you spend the cash, it will work
If you spend the cash, it will work
<sigh>
Well, Don't say I didn't try to warn you...
Good luck and hopefully better luck than the other Departments had. Motorola tried to say it was a programming issue with LAPD too. Then then tried to say it was a "Training issue". Then they just did away with simplex and stated that it was the best they could do.
Once again...good luck, and I hope no one gets hurt.
Well, Don't say I didn't try to warn you...
Good luck and hopefully better luck than the other Departments had. Motorola tried to say it was a programming issue with LAPD too. Then then tried to say it was a "Training issue". Then they just did away with simplex and stated that it was the best they could do.
Once again...good luck, and I hope no one gets hurt.
-
aaron_tech
- Posts: 76
- Joined: Sat Sep 29, 2001 4:00 pm
Like I said before no provider has a good digital solution. But the digital prob with Mot is in Simulcast. A non-simulcast Astro system 99% of the time works like a champ. The honking that la was refering to is a sych issue in true simulcast systems. I have a astro cconventional simulcast and it works great 99% of the time but we'll periiods were my customer gets the honking. I'll check the tensr bank logs to check the T-1 and it won't show any failures but when you check the astrotac and quantar logs you get errors that indicate extended frames and synch issues. This in my opinion is an astro tac issue. My analog simulcast channels for the same customer don't ever have problems. This in my opinion is because in astro the astro-tac 3000 sets the time stamp for the retransmitted audio as were in analog the DSM-II card in the Tnsr Channel bank sets the time stamp. The The quantars in astro delay 2usecs from the time stamp the key up in analog the DSM-II creates the delay and then keys up. To my knowledge your upgrade should not have any real astro problems because I believe you said I wasn't simulcast. I think but can't prove that the Astro-tac time stamp is getting mixed up with the DSM time stamp and that may becausing the issue. But its a real issu and for the most part only with MOt because Mot is the only provider that does true Simulcast.
Aaron
Aaron
-
aaron_tech
- Posts: 76
- Joined: Sat Sep 29, 2001 4:00 pm
we recently sold and installed a Mixed system for a Canadian city. e used 4 astro simulcast conventional VHF channels for police and fire and 6 channels vhf trunking for Roads Transit etc. Police loved the Astro due the improved coverage and security. The fire not as much. Recovered voice suffers with background noise and SCBA use. I would not recommend for fireground use.