Analog Railroad Spectra Support.

RailroadTech · Post by **RailroadTech** » Fri Sep 01, 2006 5:09 am

I have a support issue with the Analog Railroad Spectra the Motorola depot does not support the product.

Motorola stopped building Analog Spectras in 2004 but I sent the Depot a radio for repair and it came back this product is no longer supported !!!! After calling around and getting nowhere I found out that the VHF RF board is obsolete. I guess the Motorola depot can not be bothered to fix VHF RF boards so I have to try and repair them.

I would like some help and advise I can get. I got to try and keep these radios going for at least another four years.

Any advise on places I maybe able to get working HLN6001 VHF RF boards?

or Analog VHF Spectras which I can salvage the RF boards from?

Are these RF boards repairable or is there really parts that can not be purchased and I would need to get to repair them?

Finally Troubleshooting advise...

I find 3 common problems.

1)
The most scary problem after 20 or 30 minutes the radio goes out of lock. Well since the radio uses a phase lock loop the problem can be caused by anything.

I think the main clue is the board intermittently unlocks in time but I am not sure where to start. Anybody have repair hints guides?

2)
I find the audio degrades the level is just not as high as it used to be. In a railroad cab audio really must be loud !!!! I suspect and issue around U301 the IF IC. Anybody see this have any ideas?

3)
Squelch seems to degrade over time but this is not really a major problem. I can increase the Squelch pot to 15 if I have to. Must be related to 2) and the heart of it must be an audio problem.

Now I have lurked the board in the past and I read that the electrolytic caps in analog Spectra is a real problem not only on the RF board but the Command board as well. Does replacing caps really solve some of the issues lists above? Are the caps really that bad? If they leak over time can they damage the board?

Because I really am not sure how dependable a repair on these old RF boards can be "some are 20 years old" I rather find a source of good working VHF RF boards but if I have to rework them I will.

Last question can you convert an UHF, or 800 MHz board to VHF if I really get stuck.

I know I am asking for much .....

But I do thank you in advance for any help.

Thank You RailroadTech.

kcbooboo · Post by **kcbooboo** » Fri Sep 01, 2006 6:55 am

From what I've read and heard, the caps really can cause tons of problems, and replacing them will cure many evils. Depending on how long they've been leaking, you might have some serious board repairs to do, fixing traces that got eaten away. There are at least two people on this BBS who repair Spectras; one of them will surely pop up and post something to this thread.

The Spectra Detailed service manual has troubleshooting flowcharts and some theory of operation, as well as limited board testing procedures. I don't know how much of the RR Spectra is similar to a regular Spectra, but if there's a RR Detailed service manual still available, that's probably the one you should try to buy. Since the radios are MD, the manual stock will be limited to whatever Motorola still has lying around. Once they're gone, that's it.

The HRN6001B VHF RF board (not hLn - that's a logic board) is in the manual. The same board schematic is used for all four bands (VHF, UHF, 800, 900); parts and jumpers are different between them. As long as the bandwidths are the same (VHF and UHF would be), you might be able to go through the parts lists (they're chock-full of errors and omissions) and figure out what needs to be changed. An easier route would be to buy a regular VHF Spectra and steal the RF board. They're often found on eBay.

Bob M.

kc7gr · Post by **kc7gr** » Fri Sep 01, 2006 7:28 am

RailroadTech wrote:I have a support issue with the Analog Railroad Spectra the Motorola depot does not support the product. Motorola stopped building Analog Spectras in 2004 but I sent the Depot a radio for repair and it came back this product is no longer supported !!!! After calling around and getting nowhere I found out that the VHF RF board is obsolete. I guess the Motorola depot can not be bothered to fix VHF RF boards so I have to try and repair them.

<BigSnip>

All the symptoms you're describing can be caused by the infamous "leaking aluminum electrolytic caps" on the RF and/or command boards (the RF board is usually first to suffer).

As kcbooboo mentioned, I'm one of the folks who repairs this sort of problem. I would be happy to look at it for you, if you don't mind shipping it to the Puget Sound (Seattle) area.

However, please note that I will not be doing any radio work for the next couple of weeks (until September 18th at least) due to an upcoming vacation and road trip. If you can wait that long, great!

If not, it is possible that Will could help you out faster than I could. He'll probably pop in here as well. If not, just send a PM to him.

Alternatively, if you're in no rush, let me know via PM, and we'll set something up.

Another option: If you have the tools and skill to handle desolder of surface-mount parts, cleaning the board, and attaching new parts, I could give you a 'HowTo' guide.

Let me know. Thanks much.

Radio99 · Post by **Radio99** » Fri Sep 01, 2006 11:34 am

Odd that the Depot would tell you this. The current flat rate sheet I have from the Depot (dated 08-01-06) indicates the anagog railroad Spectra is a Tier 10 repair with a flat rate of $401.00.

Maybe they confused this with a regular analog spectra which is no longer supported.

May be worth a telephone call to the Depot to get a clarification.

Post by Pj » Fri Sep 01, 2006 9:01 pm

Yeah, the analog rr spectra was only recently discontiuned, but is still supported by the depot for a few more years. I haven't seen it pop up on the no longer supported list yet. I'd call M back and speak with someone again.

MTS2000des · Post by **MTS2000des** » Fri Sep 01, 2006 9:29 pm

maybe it got lost in translation! Hector and Jose may not have gotten that far in their ESOL class to be able to understand the different types of Spectra!

Post by Pj » Fri Sep 01, 2006 9:37 pm

Just looked it up on MOL:

Spectra RailRoad Clean Cab
Manufacture Cancellation: 3/31/04
End of Support: 3/31/09
ESP: 3/31/05
SA: 3/31/08
Flat Rate: 3/31/09
Time and Material: Dependent upon parts availability

RailroadTech · Post by **RailroadTech** » Sat Sep 02, 2006 1:47 pm

kcbooboo,

I got a detailed Spectra manual. The R/R Spectra brick is a standard VHF analog Spectra. OOPs you are right about the part number.

Thanks kc7gr,

I asked my parts coordinator to order some caps and I will give replacing the caps a go. I am also on vacation most of September. I may pick you mind and the How to Guide.. Do not want you to go through too much trouble...

Pj, MTS2000des, Radio99 yup I got the same info from MOL but still got nowhere talking to Motorola. They told me they could not fix my radio... Maybe I should of not given up so easy. I have a funny feeling in the next 2 1/2 years Motorola will get more complaints.

I told my manager it be worth buying some analog Spectras from eBay. Often then go for less than a flat rate and it would give me spare parts if I need to scrape a board.

kc7gr · Post by **kc7gr** » Sun Sep 03, 2006 12:13 pm

RailroadTech wrote:kcbooboo,

I got a detailed Spectra manual. The R/R Spectra brick is a standard VHF analog Spectra. OOPs you are right about the part number.

Thanks kc7gr,

I asked my parts coordinator to order some caps and I will give replacing the caps a go. I am also on vacation most of September. I may pick you mind and the How to Guide.. Do not want you to go through too much trouble...

<snippety>

Oh, no trouble at all. Here's some tips for doing the job.

First off, the quality of components used is important. I don't use the stock Motorola replacement parts because they're way too costly (from Motorola), and because I suspect they're no better in quality than the original parts.

I use, instead, Panasonic 'HD' series aluminum electrolytics, bought from Digi-Key. They're rated for 5000 hours life at 85 degrees C, which is a heck of a lot hotter than the environment the radio would normally be exposed to.

Carefully remove the old caps using a 'HoTweezer' style desolder tool, or a fine-point iron and a stainless-steel dental pick. Once you have the old caps clear of the board, it is VITALLY important that you clean the areas where the caps were with 99% Isopropanol (better known as Isopropyl Alcohol). DO NOT use 70% or 93% solutions -- They both contain too much water. You can find the 99% strength at larger electronic supply places (Fry's has it in their electronic chemicals section).

In all cases, use a short-bristled acid brush (you can get these from well-stocked hardware stores) to clean the areas. Be liberal with the alcohol, and be sure you let the board dry thoroughly before going any further.

Next step: Apply a fresh coat of solder to all the capacitor pads, and then de-solder them again with a power desoldering tool (Pace units do fine with this). This will leave a nice coat of fresh tin/lead on the pads which will make it that much easier to attach the replacements.

Finally, using a fine-point iron at about 700-750 degrees, solder the new caps in place.

That should about do it. Be mindful of physical positioning of the new caps (have an equal amount of pad showing on each side), and of their polarity markings.

Happy fixing.

jwb8734 · Post by **jwb8734** » Mon Sep 04, 2006 7:09 pm

Well maybe it's because

Motorola Service Center
45-D Butterfield Trail
El Paso, TX 79906

So maybe the new help doesnt know better yet or is brainwashed.

But my MOL says
Spectra RailRoad Analog Clean Cab Radio
3/31/2004- Discontinued
3/31/2009-End of Support
3/31/2005- ESP
3/31/2008- SA
3/31/2009- Flat Rate
Dependent upon parts availability

Will · Post by **Will** » Mon Sep 04, 2006 11:40 pm

"3/31/2009- Flat Rate
Dependent upon parts availability"

Well that tells it all. They just swap out boards, and they have NO more good ones at Depot.
I can repair the boards here, and I have mill spec replacement parts.

Post by Pj » Tue Sep 05, 2006 12:31 am

jwb8734 wrote:3/31/2009- Flat Rate
Dependent upon parts availability

If you look at the Matrix for 8/25/06, T&M is a different colum, not to be confused with "flat rate".

Either way, with 10,000+ railroad spectra's out there, I am sure they have a good parts supply and that he is talking to a telephone drone.

jwb8734 · Post by **jwb8734** » Tue Sep 05, 2006 2:17 am

Pj wrote:
jwb8734 wrote:3/31/2009- Flat Rate
Dependent upon parts availability
If you look at the Matrix for 8/25/06, T&M is a different colum, not to be confused with "flat rate".

That is correct Each date is a different line and the "Dependent upon parts availability" is another.

The matrix says that alot too. So it looks like they dont want to fix anything.

RailroadTech · Post by **RailroadTech** » Tue Sep 05, 2006 4:26 am

Thanks kc7gr.

Dependant upon parts availability....

You think Motorola would at least when they send a radio back say the radio could not be repaired because HRN6001 is nolonger available, and then give you the reason why they could not fix the RF board.

I guess I am asking to much.

Analog Railroad Spectra Support.

Analog Railroad Spectra Support.

Re: Analog Railroad Spectra Support.

Analog Railroad Spectra