Batboard

Looking for radios for Incident Command Vehicle. Radio installer quoted both Motorola CDM1250 and Kenwood TK 690 and TK790. (need both VHF hi and Low)

Any opinions on which is the better choice in terms of reliability, programming, ease of use etc

Any opinions are appreciated

CDM would be my preference (and you will get a lot of opinions)
Make sure that you buy the 1-25 watt models. That way you can have a low power button (set for 5 watts for example).
With multiple radios in a vehicle you will have a problem with desense (key one radio and wipe out the other radios ability to receive).
Most on-scene events can easily be handled on low power. Only use high power when required.

You're comparing two different classes of radio, really.

The CDM1250 is more in line with the TK-7180 mobile, while the TK-690/790 is more in line with analog-only XTL2500.

Since you need lowband, I would seriously consider going with the TK-690 for that, and then the TK-5710 for your VHF Hi needs. Looks the same as a TK-790, but, for less than $1K more, you're adding full P25 digital capability. Good future-proofing.

As far as price. The Kenwood will be more expensive. The CDM radio is OK but rx audio is not as good as the Kenwood. Have you thought about ICOM, yes ICOM. The radios out now are just as reliable as the Motorola and Kenwood, not to mention that the ICOM line is priced very well.

The Motorola CDM1250 is not comparable to the Kenwood 790/890. The Kenwood 790/890 is is a class on its, own. The next step up would be the Motorola Astro Spectra, Astro Spectar Plus, and XTL Series.


Look at the ICOM F121, 221 Series, the 521,621 Series and the High end mobile series which are P25 upgradeable. The 1721,1821,2721,2821 are the models.

Hope this helps.

The CDM radio is OK but rx audio is not as good as the Kenwood

This is a joke, right?

Um....not a joke at all. The CDM audio blows.

jim wrote:Um....not a joke at all. The CDM audio blows.

Exactly. The Kenwood audio rocks... especially the 7180s and 790s into an external speaker.

tvsjr: again we meet in a discussion of Moto vs Kenwood. I have to ask, what are you guys doing that you are getting such poor audio out of the CDM series?

I have never had a problem they are always loud, and crystal clear.

Each models has it's ups and downs, here's a few I can think of at the moment.

CDM1250s aren't very good if you need multiple channel banks, there are only 4 programmable buttons, to change banks you'll end up having to go through a menu, which is a pain.

As far as I know the TK programming software is still DOS based and not particularly user friendly, someone correct me if they've come out with a Windows based version.

The TKs can be set up as dual head, dual band, and dual band/dual head.

I would say overall the TK is the better radio, but it also depends on your specific needs.. for instance our local PDs and FDs all use MDC IDs, so we stick to Moto radios for them, otherwise we'd be wiring in third party ID modules all the time.

I'd recommend getting brochures on both and look over the features.

One more thing, I don't know about the other models in the XTL line, but so far I'm underwhelmed with the XTL1500s.

Vercomm wrote:tvsjr: again we meet in a discussion of Moto vs Kenwood. I have to ask, what are you guys doing that you are getting such poor audio out of the CDM series?

Turning them on.

Go with the Kenwoods!!! Yes they have Windows based software. But just like RSS vs CPS, it's what you like. DOS for me.

Jim.

I'd have to agree with the Kenwoods with their audio and flexibility for what you are using them for. As much as I really wanted to put Moto's in at the FD refit, we went with the Kenwood 90 Series radios and were not disappointed.

The little old CDM speaker just does not compare to a nice sized remote speaker. Chances are in a command vehicle the audio will need to be heard clearly and loudly by many, or just one or two (think a nice headset).

I have a pair of Icom 621's and they run circles around the CDM1250's we had. Superb audio even with the built in speaker, 45 watts, 250 modes, many more programmable buttons. Windows RSS is easy to use, and the radios are built very solidly and have tons of options. They were 350 new with warranty half of what a CDM costs...made in JAPAN not Mexico, China or some other third world country. Very well made radio and gives Kenwood a run for the money.

I installed 25 Kenwood TK790's and TK890's in a news fleet, and I've been very happy with them. I like the fact that I can have more than 16 channels in a zone/group/bank. A feature I love about the dual head units: you can program a button to mute the other head. Say, you were working in the back of a van, and forgot to turn the volume down on the rear head. You're driving down the road and the rear head blasts out with aircraft jet-engine level sound. Kenwood: push button. Motorola: Stop vehicle, get out, and go turn the rear head down.

Vercomm wrote:tvsjr: again we meet in a discussion of Moto vs Kenwood. I have to ask, what are you guys doing that you are getting such poor audio out of the CDM series?

I have never had a problem they are always loud, and crystal clear.

Like Jim said, simply turning them on. Take a TK-7180 or TK-790 and wire it up to a KES-5 external speaker. You'll get damn near audiophile quality audio. The CDM is muddy at best with an external speaker, and even worse on narrowband, even with the latest firmware flashes. The internal noise generator is a small piece of fabric which moves and makes noise... it's not a speaker.

jackhackett wrote:As far as I know the TK programming software is still DOS based and not particularly user friendly, someone correct me if they've come out with a Windows based version.

They've released Windows FPU for just about everything current... x60, x70/72, x80, x90, x140, x160, x170, x180, Fleetsync, and more. Quite user friendly. How many versions of Motorola CPS can import a comma-delimited file? Unlike Jim, I prefer the Windows stuff... mainly because I can run it on my T60p and don't have to dig out a DOS machine.

jackhackett wrote:for instance our local PDs and FDs all use MDC IDs, so we stick to Moto radios for them, otherwise we'd be wiring in third party ID modules all the time.

The new units like x180s have sockets built-in for MDC boards. Also, you can order the Cimarron boards straight from Kenwood, with a labor op code to have them install the board for you.

tvsjr wrote:

Vercomm wrote:tvsjr: again we meet in a discussion of Moto vs Kenwood. I have to ask, what are you guys doing that you are getting such poor audio out of the CDM series?

I have never had a problem they are always loud, and crystal clear.

Like Jim said, simply turning them on. Take a TK-7180 or TK-790 and wire it up to a KES-5 external speaker. You'll get damn near audiophile quality audio. The CDM is muddy at best with an external speaker, and even worse on narrowband, even with the latest firmware flashes. The internal noise generator is a small piece of fabric which moves and makes noise... it's not a speaker.

you can thank the nice people at Bose with that advancement, the soundpath is similar to the Bose audio systems as found in their radios...if you remove the face of a 7180, the sound goes almost silent (and that comes from a guy i know who helped design them) It's nice to be able to blast the volume of a 7180 / 3180 and actually be able to HEAR it, the HT / Pro just gets loud and then overdeviates.

They've released Windows FPU for the x80 series????

What part number?

NSPD wrote:They've released Windows FPU for the x80 series????

What part number?

KPG-49D Just like the DOS


Jim

n7maq wrote:

NSPD wrote:They've released Windows FPU for the x80 series????

What part number?

KPG-49D Just like the DOS

Jim

That's what threw me off, we only have the DOS stuff at our shop, and when I looked on Kenwood's site it showed Windows software but the part number was the same as the DOS, that's a bit confusing, the part number should indicate the difference.

I'm going to have to get the Windows stuff, right now I have three desktop computers for programming just because we still have to deal with DOS. Now if I could just get Spectra, Maxtrac and GM300 CPS for Windows and get the couple of cheap customers that are still clinging to their GE Rangers to upgrade I could cut it down to one.

Kenwood Software retains the same part number for DOS and Windows, you will need to check the software revision number to determine if it is DOS or Windows.

Wes

NSPD wrote:They've released Windows FPU for the x80 series????

What part number?

KPG-49D v4.01

I have used both the Moto CDM and the Kenwood 90 series mobiles. By far the 90 series kicks major butt! We have two command vehicles setup with the 690 and 790 on one head. But to make it even better we have them setup in dual head config. Allowing us to have a head up front with the driver and one in the back with the command area. It is very convient have two bands on one head.
The programming of the Kenwood also is so much easier than Moto. The one problem I have found is that the 90 series hasn't been updated in awhile and lacks some of the common features that the 150 and 180 Kenwood mobiles have.
If I were you I would go Kenwood.

David