Batboard

I've ready every related thread on here but I can't find a concrete answer. Can I use a normal RIB and normal RJ45 mic jack RIB-to-Radio cable to do a firmware update and not use the flash adapter?

This is a snippet from the readme:

The following instructions detail the operations of the Firmware Kit:

(Note: These instructions must be followed in the exact order to work properly):

1. Power on the radio. If the ignition is on, turn off all other accessories to
ensure the quietest possible environment. Do not run the engine during this
procedure.

2. (i) For Ribless cable
--------------------
Connect the AARKN4081B programming cable to the microphone jack of the radio.
The Programming cable is connected to the adapter, and the adapter is
connected to the computer serial port (9 pin) through the 25 to 9 pin Converter.
Note: the Converter is not requiring if serial port is 25 pin.

(ii) For Rib Cable
----------------
Connect the AARKN4083A programming cable to the rear connector of the radio.
The Programming cable is connected to RLN4008E Radio Interface Box and it connected
to the computer serial port by RIB to PC cable, P/N 3080369B72 (9pin) or 3080369B71 (25pin)
Note: The Converter is not requiring if serial port is 25 pin.
: Maximum baud rate for this equipment is 19,200 Bd.

3. If you using a laptop ensure that "Transmit Buffer" in the Advanced Port Settings
window is not positioned at the highest setting. See troubleshooting section
"Adjusting Transmit Buffer" below for details.

4. Make sure that the switch in the HLN9742B adapter is in the OFF position.

The part about connecting when using a RIB says nothing about the flash adapter and says to connect the programming cable to the rear connector. Then in step 4, it says to set the adapter for off, so I'm assuming that is only if you are using the ribless cable? The only cable I have is the one for the front mic jack using a RIB so I'm hoping it will actually just work and be happy? Should it, and if so, has anyone done it?

yes you absolutely have to use the flash adaptor or how else would you boot the radio? i use the 20 pin on the back to update the cdm's and it works flawless but i've read that people do use the mic jack, never seen it done that way so can't confirm it but the biggest thing is that it don't matter if you use the mic jack or the rear 20 pin you have to have the adaptor to boot the radio. and the stand alone firmware upgrade porgram.

I reflash CDM1250s using the Mot ribless cable plugged into the mic jack and the flash adapter between the ribless and the PC. I've also reflashed using the accessory jack cable with the flash adapter, a RIB, and a PC. The big thing is you have to use a flash adapter to *prevent* the radio from booting up normally - i.e. using program memory external to the radio's uP. When the boot control line is tied low by switching in the flash adapter the radio's uP only uses program memory internal to the uP rather than the radio's 'operating system' which is stored in external menory.

There general consensus seems to be that upgrading through the rear connector is the preferred and reliable method. Upgrading through the mic jacks also works, at least most of the time...

IMHO, pretty much everyone who does a significant quantity of upgrades on these has decided to stick to the rear accessory connector after making a brick or two doing it through the mic jack.

You definitely cannot / should not do it through the mic jack with the head remoted.

On the flash adapter, you use the "A" position to put the radio into bootstrap mode when flashing through the accessory connector, and the "B" position when using the mic jack.

You can only flash through the mic jack if using the AARKN4081B ribless programming cable, as it uses the extra 2 pins in the mic jack. You cannot use the standard Maxtrac cable/RIB combo most of us use for regular programming.

Todd

Dag blast it! Thats all I have.

Well, just order yourself the RLN4853 adapter (probably between $8-$10, depending on your pricing) and you should be good to go with the rear accessory connector.

wavetar wrote:You can only flash through the mic jack if using the AARKN4081B ribless programming cable, as it uses the extra 2 pins in the mic jack. You cannot use the standard Maxtrac cable/RIB combo most of us use for regular programming.

Todd

Ok, a normal programming cable contains 8 pins on the mic connector. The programming cable that can be used to flash has 10 pins. What pin on the 10 pin mic plug is the boot control? It's gotta be 1 or 10

Thanks

Well, here's what the service manual shows for the pins. It would appear at least some of them are dual purpose, as pins 1 & 10 are only labeled as mic keypad row & column inputs.

Hmm, what pin is the boot control then? I'd like to build a cable that I can flash CDM through the front. So far only flashing through the rear connector has worked for me. It's gotta be the extreme left or right pins on the 10 pin front mic.

Thanks for the image, I must not have looked through the service manual throughly enough.

Boot control is on pin18 of Accessory Connector.
To enter Boot Mode this line must be connected to ground (Accessory Connector pin 7 for exaple) when the radio is
switched on.
You can use any appropriate cable for programming through mic jack and enter Boot Mode, when it prompted,
just shorting this pins on Accessory Connector.
I hope you know numbering of Accessory Connector.

On the AARKN4081 programming cable, pin 25 of the DB25 connector is the boot control line, and it's tied directly to pin 6 of the RJ style connector(pin 6 is labelled ptt/ir decoder). When the CDM is powered up, the internal uP checks the ptt line, and if it's low, enters the firmware update mode where the uP uses only memory internal to itself rather than external memory where the firmware is stored.

Al wrote:On the AARKN4081 programming cable, pin 25 of the DB25 connector is the boot control line, and it's tied directly to pin 6 of the RJ style connector(pin 6 is labelled ptt/ir decoder). When the CDM is powered up, the internal uP checks the ptt line, and if it's low, enters the firmware update mode where the uP uses only memory internal to itself rather than external memory where the firmware is stored.

Hmm, I double check my homebrew cable and in boot mode pin 6 is taken to ground but the CDM's still won't go to boot mode. Using the same output from the modified RIB and using the rear connector Boot mode works like it should.. Confirmed with DVM that pin 6 on mic connector is going to ground on the RF-45 plug, even open the head and verified mic pin 6 is going to ground. This should be a no-brainer.... Oh well I'll figure it out someday, till then flashing through the accessory connector (I was gonna say "flashing through the rear", but I didn't want anyone to get the wrong idea )

I work at a /\/\ shop doing most of the firmware updates. I found some cable pinout information on Batlabs and if this is the cable you are using, that may be your issue. The programming cable pinout on Batlabs is wrong! Well, not really wrong but incomplete. Here is the pinout from Batlabs:

http://www.batlabs.com/images/cdmprog.gif

I am referring to the TOP diagram. If you made a cable from this diagram, it is MISSING AN IMPORTANT WIRE! This cable is fine for programming but if you need to put the radio in boot mode for a firmware update, the wire is not there. I did a firmware update from the mic jack. I did not try it from the rear connector. To do a firmware update, you need the HLN9742B adapter and you are going to use the "B" position when upgrading a CDM750/1250 from the mic connector. I have a true, overpriced HLN9742B. I also USED A RIB! Someone mentioned that you can only do it with a ribless cable. That is incorrect. You also DO NOT need a 10 pin connector.

To understand why the cable pinout found on Batlabs will not work, take a look at the "schematic" for an HLN9742B here:

http://www.aradiod.co.za/Products/getbrochure.php?id=63

As I mentioned, you need to use the "B" position for a firmware upgrade of a CDM line radio. When you throw the switch on the adapter, it shorts pin 25 to pin 12 on the radio side of the adapter. Now look at the pinout for the programming cable found on Batlabs again:

http://www.batlabs.com/images/cdmprog.gif

Pin 12 is not used! Throwing the switch will not do a thing! There is a wire that reads "BOOT" going from pin 25 on the DB25 to pin 6 on an RJ45 but it doesn't go anywhere, with or without the switch thrown.

So how do you make the cable work for firmware upgrades? Add a wire from pin 12 on the DB25 side to pin 5 on your RJ45! That's all there is to it. When you throw the switch, it shorts pins 5 and 6 on the mic jack, which is how the radio goes into boot mode.

When you run the firmware update program, the radio should be on and the adapter switch should be in the center (off) position. Run the program and follow the instructions on the screen. It will tell you to throw the switch to the B position and then hit the power button on the radio twice, pausing at least one second between presses. After doing that, click OK (or upgrade, I forget what it actually says) and you are off and running.

I just made a rear 20-pin connector programming cable and put a switch on the DB25 that grounds the bootstrap pin. It cost me $4.50 at radio shack for the DB25 and a little switch.

N1GTL, well that explains it. I was racking my head on this one, and was just starting to think something was incorrect or incomplete on the schematic posted on batlabs.

Ok, from what I can see now, position "A" will put the HT series into boot. Position "A" will also put the CDM's into boot mode, BUT only from the rear 20 pin connector. Flashing from the front requires position "B"

Position "A" grounds pin 25 on the adapter (flashing HT series, and CDM's through the rear connector)
Position "B" connects connects 12 to 25 (flashing CDM's from the front)

This all makes sense now. Thanks for sharing your information with the board, and welcome to the board N1GTL. I will rework my Super RIB to reflect this new information

nmfire10 wrote:I just made a rear 20-pin connector programming cable and put a switch on the DB25 that grounds the bootstrap pin. It cost me $4.50 at radio shack for the DB25 and a little switch.

Yep, that would work perfect, but I have built a super RIB that has all the "adapters" built in for convience.

I use the normal Ariane series mic. jack programming cable and RIB for firmware upgrade!
You only have to put bootcontrol,on the rear connector,to ground.
I made a rear connector plug with a little switch on it, to bootstrap the radio.

Andreas

I just flashed a couple CDM 1250 using the accessory connector and grounding pin 18.

I had 1 that would not go into Boot Mode and found that the front power button MUST be programed in CPS for
ON/OFF & IGNITION for the flash to work, this one was set for ignition only. Changed it and it flashed with no problem.

I also do not think anyone mentioned that the radio turns off in the first press of the power button and remains with the display blank during the rest of the flash update. The display does not return untill you power the radio down and back up again at the end of the flash.

n1gtl wrote:I work at a /\/\ shop doing most of the firmware updates. I found some cable pinout information on Batlabs and if this is the cable you are using, that may be your issue. The programming cable pinout on Batlabs is wrong! Well, not really wrong but incomplete. Here is the pinout from Batlabs:

http://www.batlabs.com/images/cdmprog.gif

I am referring to the TOP diagram. If you made a cable from this diagram, it is MISSING AN IMPORTANT WIRE! This cable is fine for programming but if you need to put the radio in boot mode for a firmware update, the wire is not there. I did a firmware update from the mic jack. I did not try it from the rear connector. To do a firmware update, you need the HLN9742B adapter and you are going to use the "B" position when upgrading a CDM750/1250 from the mic connector. I have a true, overpriced HLN9742B. I also USED A RIB! Someone mentioned that you can only do it with a ribless cable. That is incorrect. You also DO NOT need a 10 pin connector.

To understand why the cable pinout found on Batlabs will not work, take a look at the "schematic" for an HLN9742B here:

http://www.aradiod.co.za/Products/getbrochure.php?id=63

As I mentioned, you need to use the "B" position for a firmware upgrade of a CDM line radio. When you throw the switch on the adapter, it shorts pin 25 to pin 12 on the radio side of the adapter. Now look at the pinout for the programming cable found on Batlabs again:

http://www.batlabs.com/images/cdmprog.gif

Pin 12 is not used! Throwing the switch will not do a thing! There is a wire that reads "BOOT" going from pin 25 on the DB25 to pin 6 on an RJ45 but it doesn't go anywhere, with or without the switch thrown.

So how do you make the cable work for firmware upgrades? Add a wire from pin 12 on the DB25 side to pin 5 on your RJ45! That's all there is to it. When you throw the switch, it shorts pins 5 and 6 on the mic jack, which is how the radio goes into boot mode.

When you run the firmware update program, the radio should be on and the adapter switch should be in the center (off) position. Run the program and follow the instructions on the screen. It will tell you to throw the switch to the B position and then hit the power button on the radio twice, pausing at least one second between presses. After doing that, click OK (or upgrade, I forget what it actually says) and you are off and running.

If you want, update the diagram for it, and PM me for my email address. I'll forward these updates for Bat so he can update the page. Bonus points if you want to download and update the CDM page to reflect your findings, and send that in it's entirety.

-Alex

MassFD wrote:I just flashed a couple CDM 1250 using the accessory connector and grounding pin 18.

I had 1 that would not go into Boot Mode and found that the front power button MUST be programed in CPS for
ON/OFF & IGNITION for the flash to work, this one was set for ignition only. Changed it and it flashed with no problem.

I also do not think anyone mentioned that the radio turns off in the first press of the power button and remains with the display blank during the rest of the flash update. The display does not return untill you power the radio down and back up again at the end of the flash.

Having a CDM set for ignition only is risky. There have been documented issues of a voltage spike blowing out the ignition control circuitry in the radio. Once that happens, you cannot turn the radio on and it is off to the depot. I usually set radios for ON/OFF & IGNITION as you mention. /\/\ offers a kit for the CDM to regulate the voltage on the ignition circuit.

Also, when firmware upgrading from the mic jack, you throw the switch on the adapter and hit the power button twice. The display never shuts off when you do this. It may be different when doing it from the rear jack; I have never tried that.

I prefer the mic jack since I run across CDM's built into consoles (Havis-Shields, etc) and getting at the mic jack is a lot easier than pulling the radio. It is also easier to have a single cable.