Batboard

Help Okay I have been tasked with sitting up a voted p25 digital system in conventional mode


I have

2 astro Tac receivers
1 astrotac 3000
1 Quantar Repeater
2 V.3225 modems

I am trying to figure out what cabling I need to wire the parts together for mixed mode analog and digital function

I have the quantar/astrotac software and cable to program

I have the repeater setup on frequency and it works in standalone mode

I have attempted to program the 3000 and I get a flashing red/green led on both WLan on wlan fail

and a red link fail



On the receiver i get a flashing v.24 led and astro tac rcvr on


Any help greatly appreciated as this is all new to me

Don't take this the wrong way, but if you have not taken the training at Motorola, I sugest contracting Motorola to do the configuration. You can install all the hardware, just have them do the turn up.

I wish I had the training but unfortuanley Can't seem to get the boss to send any of us to any school for the new stuff only thing i have been trained on is the 3600 and 6809 controllers.

I have spoke to 2 ppl at motorola on the ACES team and they want nothing to do with it since the system wasn't speced by them

I assume that this is not a public safety system them. Sorry, not a lot of help, but without training, it will be a tough road for you to accomplish the task at hand.

How are you tying all this together? Leased lines? Microwave?

Since it sounds like the original internal Astro Modem isn't available anymore, I'm guessing that's why you ended up with the UDS external modems. I'm not sure if you have enough of them, though.

If you don't have any of the internal Astro Modems, you'll need the CLN1185 V.24 cards in everything--the Quantar, AstroTAC Receivers, and at least three of them in the Comparator. Your UDS modems would connect to these V.24 ports and turn the full duplex 9600 bps synchronous serial data into an audio signal that can go on a 4-wire voice grade circuit.

Are the Quantar and Astro-TAC 3000 going at the same site? If so, you probably won't need any modems for that connection--you should be able to make that one directly between the two V.24 ports. If they're more than 50 feet apart, or if you run into latency issues, you may need to use the same modems on this link.

For the receivers, you'll need one modem and V.24 card at each end, so that's 4 of each.

Mixed mode operation will make this whole thing more tricky, especially with V.24 cards and external modems. The V.24 interfaces only carry digital traffic, so you'll need to do separate wiring for the analog traffic. I don't have any experience with analog on an AstroTAC comparator, but I'm guessing you'd use the orange wireline connectors for these connections.

The now discontinued TLN3265 Motorola Astro modems made mixed mode operation pretty simple. All you had to do was make the 4-wire modem connections, and both analog and digital operation would be supported over that one 4-wire link. I don't think you'll be able to do this with the external UDS modems. For mixed mode, you'll probably need a total of two 4-wire connections between the comparator and each Quantar or receiver.

Also, keep in mind that for the system to really 'vote' properly, all of the signals from the Quantar and recievers need to arrive at the comparator within 100 milliseconds of each other. This could be a problem if you're using an IP network for backhaul.

515 Thanks for your reply


I have 1 Quantar andMotorola Is shipping me the V.24 card that was supposed to be in this unit and was not should have it in a day or 2, The astro tac 3000 will be at the same site as the Quantar

The 2 satellite receiver laoctions have the v.24 card installed

I have also been supplied with Canopy ptp5800 links for the 2 remote sites, I have 2 modems for each site and 1 ptp link for each site

So I have 2 ptp links and 4 modems

I guess the biggest hold up is getting the v.24 card for the quantar and getting everything cabled and prorgammed as I have been supplied no cables I did find a schematic for making the modem to receiver cables

Do the Canopy/PTP units have an analog audio interface, like a 4 wire E&M port? I don't remember the PTP stuff having an analog 4 wire interface, but maybe some do... If they don't, you'll need to convert the modem audio to IP or to a T1.

The T1 route is probably more consistent in terms of latency, but it would require a channel bank of some kind at each end. An Adtran TA750 could be used to get your modem audio into T1 format for the PTP radio. Another alternative for T1 would be to skip the modems, and go straight from V.24 to T1 with the Adtran TA1500. There's more info in this thread:

http://batboard.batlabs.com/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=83686

If you go the IP route, you'll really have to pay attention to the latency if you want the system to really vote properly. The RAD IP-MUX 1E can convert the modem audio to IP, or the Juniper Networks CTP 1002 can convert the V.24 data and analog audio to IP.

It would be nice if someone would make some little 900 MHz license free data radios that can handle 9600 bps full duplex synchronous serial data.

According to Motorola Aces who fiannly called me back after a week of waiting has advised that since I will be running digital p25 only I won't be utilizing the 4wire output at all that I Will run from teh quantar and the satellite receivers direct from the V.24 ports to the modems and out of the modems directly to the ptp canopy system which will transmsit the 9600bps data down the canopy bridge to the voter

If i understand everything correctly since I won't be using analog anymore i won't nee to convert the 4wire audio

Being digital-only will simplify your situation quite a bit...

The biggest question is how will the modems connect to the Canopy radios. The ones I'm familiar with only have ethernet and/or T1 connections, neither of which are directly compatible with the modems or V.24 data.

The modems convert the V.24 serial data to modem tones (an audio signal) that are compatible with most voice grade phone lines. This needs to be a full duplex connection, even for an AstroTAC receiver, so a 4-wire audio interface to the Canopy radio would be required.

Hopefully you've got some kind of Canopy radios that have a 4 wire audio interface, otherwise you'll need some unit to convert either the V.24 data or modem audio to T1 or ethernet.

Got everything setup using a null rj45 cable between each satellite receiver and the comparator by putting the v.24 cards into local control mode. so now as soon as i get the modems i should be able to flip the dip switches program the modems and hopefully be good to go