World Wide ham bands...what Freq and radios?

STX 821 · Post by **STX 821** » Wed Jul 30, 2003 2:33 pm

i am not really big into the Ham Scene and i do have a 2 meter licsense but i never gotten around to asking what band is the World wide international Band?...and what is the Freq range on that?....and what radio would be a good radio to get to monitor it?...

wa2zdy · Post by **wa2zdy** » Wed Jul 30, 2003 2:46 pm

Well, I've been a ham almost 29 years (see my user name) and I've never heard of a 2 meter license.

That aside . . .

You will hear long distance communication on the HF bands - 3.5-4 MHz, 7-7.3 MHz, 14.14.35MHz, and some others. Those are the best to listen to at first. There are other ham bands on HF, but for a start, those three are good.

Use any general coverage shortwave receiver that can receive SSB transmissions. Most cheap "worldband" radios (as they're marketed) receive AM only, as that's what shortwave broadcasters use. Hams use SSB almost exclusively, though you may hear a few using AM. And of course there will be some morse code you hear, as well as other modes.

Good luck, I hope this helps you get started.

k4wtf · Post by **k4wtf** » Wed Jul 30, 2003 5:53 pm

STX 821 wrote:i am not really big into the Ham Scene and i do have a 2 meter licsense but i never gotten around to asking what band is the World wide international Band?...and what is the Freq range on that?....and what radio would be a good radio to get to monitor it?...

Please tell me that you're bull$h!##ing us! You either don't have a ticket or you SHOULDN'T have a ticket based on your lack of knowledge of license classes, spectrum allocations and RF propagation. Is this what we are to expect from the new crop of amateurs?

I tend to agree with -ZDY on where to listen. Which band you'll hear the most distant stations on will depend on the MUF (maximum usable frequency) at the time you're listening. Having a resonant antenna to receive with will also greatly increase your success at hearing distant stations.

If you have any neon lights or X10 "dimmers" in close proximity to your receive antenna or listening position, they will cause you some issues. The X10 devices "dim" the lights by "pulsing" the circuit and not by attenuating it. Full-ON of Full-OFF are your best bet with OFF being silent and Full-ON (in my experience) still causing some minor interference.

--
John

wa2zdy · Post by **wa2zdy** » Wed Jul 30, 2003 6:39 pm

k4wtf wrote: Please tell me that you're bull$h!##ing us! You either don't have a ticket or you SHOULDN'T have a ticket based on your lack of knowledge of license classes, spectrum allocations and RF propagation. Is this what we are to expect from the new crop of amateurs?

Well John, that was my first thought too, but I'm a regular on qrz.com, and the stuff I see there is equally uninformed, so I really can't decide. The way things have been going in ham radio the past decade or so, I wouldn't bet on a lot of new hams sounding much better. I think it's just the way it is anymore.

No-code has "saved" ham radio. I'm just not sure it's a ham radio I want to embrace into my dotage.

nc5p · Post by **nc5p** » Thu Jul 31, 2003 7:43 am

Folks,

Please be nice. I would imagine he meant to say he had a tech license. I think he was asking about HF frequencies, which a tech licensee might not be familiar with (although there are a few questions on the test).

160 meters 1.8-2.0 MHz
80 meters 3.5-4.0 MHz
60 meters 5.3305,5.3465,5.3665,5.3715,5.4035 USB 50w max
40 meters 7.0-7.3 MHz
30 meters 10.1-10.15 digital/cw only
20 meters 14.0-14.35 MHz
17 meters 18.068-18.168 MHz
15 meters 21.0-21.45 MHz
12 meters 24.89-24.99 MHz
10 meters 28.0-29.7 MHz

If you pass the 5wpm code exam, you can access parts of 10 meters.

The ARRL has a nice color chart you can download from:

http://www.arrl.org/FandES/field/regula ... _color.pdf

Doug Hanz
NC5P

STX 821 · Post by **STX 821** » Thu Jul 31, 2003 11:59 am

i took the tech test and got to know a little about 7 cm and 2 cm but not all....i just needed to know what the band was called...i am not a regular on the hmas anymore between working and being with my kids...so i guess i misses alot...sorry

k4wtf · Post by **k4wtf** » Thu Jul 31, 2003 4:20 pm

STX 821 wrote:i took the tech test and got to know a little about 7 cm and 2 cm but not all....i just needed to know what the band was called...i am not a regular on the hmas anymore between working and being with my kids...so i guess i misses alot...sorry

STX 821,

I'm not trying to be mean or anything but, you are making a very sound case against the no-code technicians license. If you had absolutely no interest in radio, it would be one thing but from your posts, you are more than casually involved in RF communications and yet, you don't seem to possess some of the very basic knowledge that would be required to pass Element 3A.

The amateur band that covers 144-148Mhz is called the 2-Meter band, not the 2 cm band.

The amateur band that covers 420-450Mhz is called the 70-cm band, not the 7-cm band.

Again, I'm not trying to be mean but, it certainly sounds like you are pulling our leg about having your ticket. If you do indeed have an amateur radio license, what is your callsign?

--
John

Znarx · Post by **Znarx** » Thu Jul 31, 2003 9:59 pm

man you guys are harsh!!! remember we all have to start somewhere...if the "old" knowledgeable Hams rip the new guys this way, nobody will care if the Amateur bands are gobbled & auctioned by the FCC...just the fact that he is asking questions shows he has interest...quit harping & guide the man to the answers...Z

k4wtf · Post by **k4wtf** » Thu Jul 31, 2003 10:38 pm

Znarx wrote:man you guys are harsh!!! remember we all have to start somewhere...if the "old" knowledgeable Hams rip the new guys this way, nobody will care if the Amateur bands are gobbled & auctioned by the FCC...just the fact that he is asking questions shows he has interest...quit harping & guide the man to the answers...Z

We've given answers to his question, as much as we could based on the question. HF propagation is not as simple as there being a "The world-wide band". There are many factors that come into play.

As for "ripping" someone, that is not what we're doing. If the young man is interested in HF communications, that's great. If I heard an someone on the air asking these same questions, I'd question the validity of their license as well though. STX 821 has told us that he has an amateur radio license. As a VE, I'm wondering how that could be based on the demonstrated lack of knowledge of license classes, amateur frequency allocations, propagation theory, etc. Have a look at the question pool yourself. Element 2, Subelements T1, T2 and especially T3. I just don't have any idea how he could have made it through those portions of the test based on things he has posted in this thread.

I will be more than happy to elmer a young ham or for that matter, someone who wants to become a ham. He says he's a ham, I asked what his callsign was... No response thus far.

--
John

kf4sqb · Post by **kf4sqb** » Fri Aug 01, 2003 5:12 am

Sorry, but I have to put my 2-cents worth in, too. The "no-code" licence class has indeed gotten a lot more people onto the ham bands, but at what cost? Most hams now (most, not all) are no longer "operators", but rather "microphone holders". I just can't believe the number of newer hams who can't even install a coax connector, one of the most basic tasks any ham should know.
STX 821, I'm not trying to discorage you, nor, I don't think, is anyone else here. You seem to be doing exactly the right thing: trying to learn more about the hobby. Noone knows it all, and we all learn a little more every day (if we are doing things correctly!). Learn all you can about a wonderful hobby and enjoy yourself doing it!

wa2zdy · Post by **wa2zdy** » Fri Aug 01, 2003 2:05 pm

I'm not ripping stx821, nor do I put down less-knowledgeable newer (or older!) hams. But having been a ham 29 of my 41 years on this good Earth, I take pride in the title. I am a ham. I have dedicated much of my years to learning how to be a good one. I think I've mostly succeeded to date, though it is an ongoing process.

I take offense when someone (not saying this describes stx821 at all) claims to be a ham. Cops don't like being impersonated and most other folks don't either. Why should I? If someone wants info, I happily give it. He/she doesn't have to make false claims to "impress" me. That's not how it works.

If stx821 IS a ham, he'll gladly give us his call. Hams are not ashamed nor embarrassed. I use my call as my user name on several websites as well as for my email address. KF4SQB and K4WTF apparently agree with me that anyone with a ham license had to learn some of the basics to pass that exam. STX's questions don't seem to reflect that . Thus the questions as to whether he really is a ham.

Frankly I hope he is a ham and his willingness to learn is a good sign. If he's not, I just take liars personally.

That's MY $.02 worth.

10-95 · Post by **10-95** » Fri Aug 01, 2003 5:38 pm

I am in total agreement with Chris WA2ZDY! A basic tech class study guide covers band allocations even if you ar not going to be licensed to use HF , the study guides cover the allocations or at least they did at one time. If in fact this person is licensed it just proves how easy it is to get a ticket these days, and probably a little too easy. I have always been against dropping the code requirement to obtain a license, I know, I know , I sound like all the other old timers on HF who say "I had to learn it so they should too!" The fact is, if you want something bad enough you will work for it, or that's how it was at one time, now if you want it you memorize some questions and answers , take the test and pass and act like you have accomplished something when you really did nothing more then slip yourself in to a hobby you know very little about. Making it easier to get a ticket has done nothing to help ham radio, I see it at every major ham fest, a lot of kids memorize the questions and answers, go in and pass the tech no code and go out an by and HT and get bored with the hobby real quick and disappear, not all do this but I am sure a large majority do.

Just my opinion .

Frank
AD4XE

ricciticcitembo · Post by **ricciticcitembo** » Fri Aug 01, 2003 8:46 pm

At least when they start taking the bands away, We'll
all know WHY. If you got a Ticket and don't know your HF from your HT,
then Yeah, thats going to be a problem.....

Dave
N3WBX

clavo · Post by **clavo** » Fri Aug 01, 2003 10:59 pm

Some people study, pass, and don't touch ham radio radio again for years and years. I see it all the time. Mostly because of rule book thumping old people that make Ham unenjoyable for the younger generation. It is usually the typical angry old man that has a negative attitude toward anything progressive. Those that argue that it isn't true are just blind to it. It's really too bad. They are the ones killing the hobby for everyone.

I've always had a slight interest in getting back into HF, based on all the experiences that others have had in my age group.... I'll stay clear of it and hang out in the bands that seem more friendly and open minded toward interactions between those under 40.

HF is expensive to get into. It's not like buying a $150 hanheld. Do the younger generation a favor. If you are old and plan on dying soon, find a local ham youngster that isn't into HF and pass your gear on. Just my opinion.

-c

-c

k4wtf · Post by **k4wtf** » Fri Aug 01, 2003 11:09 pm

Join your local club and use the club station to get on HF if you can't afford your own gear. The "HF is expensive" remark is not absolutely true though. You can build (imagine that, actually making a radio appear with your soldering iron vs with your visa card!) HF gear on a budget. You can BUY HF gear on a budget too. Don't expect to get a 160m-1.2Ghz all-mode rig cheap but, you didn't specify you wanted bells and whistles.

And while there are some rule book thumpers out there, there are also some very inexperienced young (new) hams out there that need to be reminded of the rules, as well as proper operating procedure. IMHO, what is making Amateur Radio go down the tubes is the crop of "appliance operators" that couldn't tune up an antenna on a MANUAL antenna tuner or load up an amplifier to save their life.

BTW: STX 821, we haven't forgotten about you. Did you ever find your ticket? What's your callsign? I know... The dog ate it and the FCC won't tell you what your callsign is... ya... That's it! THAT'S DA TICKET!

--
John

dawson75 · Post by **dawson75** » Sat Aug 02, 2003 3:56 am

why do you older hams ( and by older i mean you guys that have been around in the hobbie for long time) have to be so mean to new no code techies???? and then you wonder why the new guys hate you all so much.

Ive been a tech now for a little over two years and i hear nothing but complaints about the "no-code techs". In some cases i agree with you guys that HAM radio is becoming the high tech C.B, But i really wish you guys would lay off the NEW TECH trash talk..

I for one have no interest in knowing morse code.

I also know that there are computer programs out there that can translate and send morse code , so why bother learning it?

this is just my opinon im not trying to do any trash talk on you guys but i see all the same stuff on qrz on a daily basis

and if STX821 is not a tech no he should not have lied about it but you know what WHO CARES!! the man is asking questions and isnt this what the board is all about!!!

dont get me wrong guys alot of you have taught me a thing or too but it just seems you guys are nit picking, help the guy get his stuff straight if he's not a ham ,oh well, if he is GREAT!!! but the main point is to help someone when they ask a question..reguardless if they are a ham or not, last time i checked you didnt need a ticket to post on the forums

thanks for listening

73's
KC8ONR
Dan Dawson

P.S Please Pardon my spelling

Nickdap · Post by **Nickdap** » Sat Aug 02, 2003 4:15 am

Do what you want as long as it doesn't disturb others on the bands. If you don't like hams that don't know that much then don't talk to them, and if you dont like hams who can carve a hf set from a tin can then don't talk to them.

But if your like me and most other younger people interested in this area who are not out just to drop fart sounds over the local repeater , you should just have fun and learn things when you can or want to.

It's not a war, if you don't know you don't really have to anymore. There will always be those who are in to HF and those into UHF/VHF and all the other stuff.

Of course having vast knowledge is a virtue in ham radio but not having doesn't really hurt anyone and certianly doesn't make the bands any quieter.

All those people who know little about radio like for example stx are just more people keeping the bands alive and in use for what ever interest they or other hams may want to pursue now or in the future.

As long as you don't act harmfully, you follow the band plans and of course pass the test theres nothing wrong. And if you get flamed for it on the radio, just turn the AF down until it clicks.

I'm not a ham, I use private freq's. I thought about becoming a ham but I can talk to more people on a commercial freq then the local 2m repeater.

Not everyone wants to sit a test, not everyone wants to sit on CB (HF & UHF CB here) and not everyone wants to pay $1000 a year to have a commercial freq. there has to be an inbetween.

Just my 2 australian cents. I swore I would never post on one of these kinda issues but just wanted to put my thoughts across as a 19 year old non ham who just payed mega bucks to the tax man/australian communications auth.

Oh and Ham radio is dying because of death and lack of interest in studying for a test. Most young people wont study for a test if they dont have to. However if you make lets just say 2m and 70cm and for the fun of it one hf band more attractive they may give it a go. Just remember no tests for the internet and tv.

OX · Post by OX » Sat Aug 02, 2003 4:15 am

I'd like to thank the old farts for convincing me that the HAM hobby is just an old farts convention. You people suck! I'd be crapping my pants that somebody wants to improve on their skills.

Ok, put this phrase into your mind 'don't use it, lose it'. He got into ham radio with a tech exam, most likely because it was cool. He suddenly found that he didn't have time to use it any more because of life and forgot some things. How many other people out there cram enough info into their heads to pass the tech exam and then who cares?

My sole purpose of joining was to communicate to my friends via a repeater instead of using a cell phone. Also I wanted to join the Skywarn nets as weather is my first hobby. But you guys have definitely convinced me that without a disaster to save the world from, ham's suck!

Good day!

nmfire10 · Post by **nmfire10** » Sat Aug 02, 2003 4:20 am

This is an interesting thread.

I am one of the "codeless techs" and here's what I have to say on this.

Did I decide not to do Morse Code because I am a lazy ignorant moronic kid? No. I didn't do it for a multitude of reasons. Would any of the "old guys" like to know why? Too bad, I'm going to tell you anyway.

1. I am not really interested in using HF right now. I personally enjoy using ham radio for more local communications. I don't need code for that.

2. At the time I took my test, I did not have the time to learn it. It was either do the no-code or do nothing at all. What would you do?

3. I am not made of money to go buy HF rigs and CW keyers. Similarly, I do not have a place for an HF antenna. So, even if I had the interest, I still wouldn't use it.

Since when did the description of Ham Radio include "If you don't know morse code, you are unworthy"? It is a hobby with many many avenues and has a little of everything. Not everyone is interested in doing EVERYTHING and nothing says you have to. If you are so stuck in your ways to not realize this, then shame on you.

Now, I also realize that this makes it easier for morons to get into the hobby. But you people say that like there were no idiots involved before!! I know plenty of people who have general and extra class licenses are complete morons as well. If you don't want to talk to the moron, DON'T TALK TO HIM!!

Nickdap · Post by **Nickdap** » Sat Aug 02, 2003 4:32 am

hear, hear!

I work full time in the litigation section of a law firm and study law part time, there is no time to build all this c*** and hide a HF antenna in my flat.

Sorry it's not c*** but it's not me, not at the moment. Local comms between my mates is what I'm in to and the little things that are involved in setting it up, like MDC signalling and all that.

anyway i'll stop now.

Doug · Post by **Doug** » Sat Aug 02, 2003 5:41 am

Well everyone now I'm going to jump on the soap box. As I've said time and again that getting your ham ticket is now your ticket to start learning and expanding your horizons. I hear alot of people flaming new hams for their operating practices, their overall knowledge and on and on. Rather than sitting and complaining about it how many of you are doing something about it? When I say doing something about it I'm talking about an old term that used to be used in the hobby some of you may have heard it before its called an "Elmer". How many of you seasoned veterans have opened your doors (shack) to the new ham (a show of hands please)
I consider myself as a new ham as well. I say this simply because I've just begun to scratch the surface of what the hobby has to offer. I've had some excellent Elmers and have also Elmered myself. Instead of flaming the new hams who ask questions we should be applauding them in their efforts for wanting to learn and grow in the hobby.
Kick me off the soap box and let the flaming of my post begin
Doug...N9JSF formerly KB9EJX

dawson75 · Post by **dawson75** » Sat Aug 02, 2003 6:12 am

Doug,

I totally agree with you!!!!!

My purpose of getting my ticket was to use it for local comms between me and a couple of friends ...so after i got my ticket i met alot of nice people over the last two years, but there are alot of OLDER hams that still dont talk to me and my buddies because we are NO-CODES (as they call us ) now instead of sitting in a corner with their little click why not come over to us OR let us come to them with some questions???? Show me what can be done in this hobby (i know ive just scratched the surface) But anyhow those are the guys im talking about the ones with there little CLICK and bash NO-CODES!!!!!

just my other .02 cents

73's
KC8ONR
Dan Dawson

Post by **HumHead** » Sat Aug 02, 2003 11:35 am

I personally think that the no code Technician was one of the best things that the FCC has done for Ham radio.

It provides an easy entry level that is accessible to anyone willing to make a moderate effort, and offers a great introduction to a lot of what ham radio has offer (including some HF/DX on 6 meters, satellite, EME, ATV etc.), while reserving other bands and privledges for those willing to explore in greater depth.

Here's another thought for the grumpy old crowd who labor under some sort of delusion about amateur radio holding some mystical elite status: Do you know how many BILLIONS of dollars of pime spectrum the ham bands occupy? Do you think Nextel and others don't look at that spectrum and drool? Do you think that the FCC is going to turn down BILLIONS in needed revenue so that a small group can practice hand-building outdated equipment? The "appliance operators" are not only the pool of talent from which the future of the hobby will be built, they are probably doing more than many care to admit to keep it alive here and now by validating our active use of prime VHF & UHF spectrum.

If you are serious about building and strengthing the amateur service, not only do we need to ease up on the new guys, we need to reach out and help them in a more constructive and positive way. Not only do we need to help them in a positive way, we need to encourage more people to join them! I doubt that anyone here is making a living as a ham. It is a HOBBY, and as such it should be enjoyable and rewarding for everyone who participates.

If you hear a new ham on the air, take a few moments to welcome them and talk to them. If they are dealing with the bitter trolls, give them some back-up. Finally, take some time to move beyond radio models, antennas, and operating procedures, and have a human conversation about weather, where you are from, local happenings, etc. It can go a long way to making someone new feel accepted, and encourage them to rise to the standards and expectations of their new circle of friends.

I thought about getting into amateur radio for a number of years, but learning the code was always a big psychological (and time) barrier. The no code Technician gave me an accessible gateway to the hobby, and got me serious about learning. I was, and continue to be, shocked by the closed-minded hostile attitudes of some hams who clearly resent the entry of newcomers into their imagined elite circles.

I am no longer a Technician, I am now an Extra, and my attitudes have not changed one bit. When I made Extra, I did not give up my old Technician call for several reasons. First, if there is a status item that I covet, it is certainly not a call sign. Second, everyone that I enjoy talking to locally already knows my current call. Finally, anyone who will look down on someone with a Technician formatted call is someone that I have no real interest in speaking with.

My wife recently became a Technician. She is intrigued by HF and DX, and has started playing with CW. Her big holdup is not the code or the exam, it's the hams that give new people a hard time over honest mistakes, or who just want to make a contact, get a QSL, and move on, without any "human interaction". Think about that the next time you bemoan the lack of qualified new hams in the ranks. They are out there, but many of them just can't find the Welcome mat.

--- Soapbox off, Nomex on ---

-... - .-- --..-- .... .- ...- .. -. --. -- .- -.. . . -..- - .-. .- --..-- .. ... - .. .-.. .-.. - .... .. -. -.- -.-. .-- .. ... .- -... --- ..- - .- ... .-. . .-.. . ...- .- -. - - --- -.. .- -.-- .- ... .- .-. . .-.. .-. .. -.. --. . .-. .- - --- .-. .. -. .- -. .. --. .-.. --- --- .-.-.- --... ...-- ...

tom IL · Post by **tom IL** » Sat Aug 02, 2003 11:47 am

I'm a Tech (no code, but by the time I got mine it was tech or tech plus) and I think it is great that there is such a thing. I did not take element 1 because I am not really interested in doing cw but that does not mean I don't have a clue what I am doing. When I took my test I took element 3 just for the heck of it and passed. My interests are more in the newer technologies like digital voice and I think a lot of the younger hams are the same way and the regular tech class lets us be hams. I think that tech has its place, especially as things like D-Star become more prevalent.

k4wtf · Post by **k4wtf** » Sat Aug 02, 2003 12:13 pm

Doug wrote:Rather than sitting and complaining about it how many of you are doing something about it? When I say doing something about it I'm talking about an old term that used to be used in the hobby some of you may have heard it before its called an "Elmer". How many of you seasoned veterans have opened your doors (shack) to the new ham (a show of hands please)

K4WTF waves his hand. On top of that, I've purchased equipment for young (new) hams as a reward for obtaining their ticket, given equipment to other younger hams when I upgraded my station, etc. This is the "Spirit" of Amateur Radio and is quite frankly the only reason I am a Ham.

I wanted to participate with my friends on 2m but, no ticket and no license. A friend told me that if I got my ticket, he'd give me a 2m rig. Another friend sat with me to practice code, gave me a key and code oscillator, and even a nice DX-60 receiver so I could copy the W1AW code practice broadcasts. It was the interest that these "old" hams took in my success that CAUSED this success and I have always felt that I owed it to them to continue the Elmer tradition.

Instead of flaming the new hams who ask questions we should be applauding them in their efforts for wanting to learn and grow in the hobby.
Kick me off the soap box and let the flaming of my post begin
Doug...N9JSF formerly KB9EJX

Doug, if you will note, the we answered STX 821 very promptly. Along with our answers to his questions, we had a few questions of our own. I applaud him for being currious but, if he's a liar and doesn't have his ticket, he's not worth my time or effort. You don't need a license to ask a question and if he doesn't have a license, why did he claim he did?

As for flaming, I'm not flaming anyone, not even those %^&# no-code technicians!

I have absolutely nothing against a no-code tech. If they don't want to enjoy CW, that's fine. I *do* have a problem with letting them on HF without having demonstrated a willingness to EARN their HF privlidges.

As for the repeaters going to hell because of the no-coders, it isn't the no-coders alone and it most certainly isn't ALL of the no-coders and most likely not even 1% of them are bad apples. The repeater owners are responsible for what goes on on their repeaters. If some idiot starts operating in violation of the standards of operation on that repeater or worse, in violation of Part 97, turn the repeater off, contact the ham in question via telephone or mail and inform them that they are no longer welcome on your repeater. Document what you have done in case further action must be taken.

Amateur Radio is a self-policing entity. It torques off a lot of people when another ham "corrects" them on their operating practice and we have all heard people go completely overboard in their "correction" but, which is worse? Being called out on the local repeater and after getting a bit red-faced, correcting your ways or.... Getting a letter from Riley that is subsequently posted to the ARRL website for the world to see?

To that end, as a credentialed VE, I have a responsibility to myself and every other licensed Amateur to make sure that the people who are granted their license actually EARN that license. If there is some irregularity at a testing session, it can cause problems not only for the VE's who were conducting the testing but also for EVERY person who sat the exams at the session. If STX 821 has a Technicians license, that's fine. If he did the "cram, test and then flush" method, I think he cheated himself. If he obtained his license by "alternate" means, it is not only invalid but, his VEs face enforcement action as well. If he's just lieing about having a ticket... Well, the only thing I hate more than a terrorist is a liar.

--
John

wa2zdy · Post by **wa2zdy** » Sat Aug 02, 2003 12:15 pm

My last comment on this thread . . .

I don't recall this starting as a no-code bash or a newbie bash. I know the question came up about the accuracy of the original poster's claim of being a ham. I notice he has yet to return to answer the question asked of him. But still, not only was he not bashed (asking a question is not bashing), he got the info he asked for.

I am ambivalent about code vs no-code. At this point it's senseless to pitch a battle anyway. The game is changing and whether or not it's changing for the better will always depend on the opinion of whoever is speaking. I liked the ham radio of old, but I continue to enjoy the ham radio of today too. And since I spend a lot of time on 2m and 440, if I didn't talk to no-coders, I wouldn't be talking much at all.

I notice a lot of newer hams come to lash out at we older guys (at age 41 I am old, what can I say?) The newer hams complain that the old guys are this and that. I think everyone needs to relax and enjoy the game. There is no excuse for the old guys to be ignorant. But some will be. By the same token, there's no excuse for the litany of posts here bashing the old guys. The following quote is a good example of inappropiate: "I'd like to thank the old farts for convincing me that the HAM hobby is just an old farts convention. You people suck! " If that is what the new hams are bringing to the hobby, then yes, ham radio will suck before too long.

Clavo brings up an interesting thought: "Some people study, pass, and don't touch ham radio radio again for years and years. I see it all the time. Mostly because of rule book thumping old people that make Ham unenjoyable for the younger generation. " I'm not sure I understand it, but he seems to be saying that those of us who believe in the rulebook are a problem. Well, that's one thing that has always kept ham radio a bit different from CB - we as a general rule, follow the rules. How exactly is that a bad thing? Yes, I follow the rules. And I encourage others to do the same. Anyone who doesn't follow the rules will usually be shut out of having many folks to talk to. Does that make us bad for not wanting to encourage rules violations? Help me out with this one, because quite frankly, I don't understand Clavo's point. When following rules is a bad thing, we've got trouble.

My last comment goes back to what was said about STX821 - most of those posters to this thread who claim to be hams also signed with their calls. Whatever your position, you told us who you are. That lends credibility, and it shows, you're still proud to be a ham. Whatever FCC required or didn't require, you met the requirements and are probably following most of the rules. Those of you who don't give a call, I wonder what you're ashamed of. And if it's ham radio you're ashamed of, why bother?

k4wtf · Post by **k4wtf** » Sat Aug 02, 2003 12:30 pm

wa2zdy wrote:My last comment goes back to what was said about STX821 - most of those posters to this thread who claim to be hams also signed with their calls. Whatever your position, you told us who you are. That lends credibility, and it shows, you're still proud to be a ham. Whatever FCC required or didn't require, you met the requirements and are probably following most of the rules. Those of you who don't give a call, I wonder what you're ashamed of. And if it's ham radio you're ashamed of, why bother?

Exactly! The only reason I can think of for someone not wanting to post their call is that it is quite easy to obtain their name and address from that information. Now.... Ask yourself... Why wouldn't someone want their name and address known to people that they interact with? Do they have something to hide? Have they scammed someone on the boards? Do they have outstanding warrants?

Or, could it be that STX 821 doesn't have a ticket, NEVER had a ticket and has simply abused the trust of every other batmember by lieing to us?

Enquiring minds want to know. What's your callsign STX 821? You can send it in a PM. I swear I won't tell anyone what it is.

--
John

Cowthief · Post by **Cowthief** » Sat Aug 02, 2003 6:25 pm

Hello.

Remember, every time you change something on your "ticket", you get a ton of mail, catalogs, magazines, etc.
If someone were to read a fraction of that stuff,,,,.
KA5PIU.
Perhaps the radio he has needs a little 52.525MHz ?.

k4wtf · Post by **k4wtf** » Sat Aug 02, 2003 6:35 pm

Cowthief wrote:Hello.

Remember, every time you change something on your "ticket", you get a ton of mail, catalogs, magazines, etc.
If someone were to read a fraction of that stuff,,,,.
KA5PIU.
Perhaps the radio he has needs a little 52.525MHz ?.

He needs some 6m primary simplex? What am I missing here?

--
John

Nickdap · Post by **Nickdap** » Sat Aug 02, 2003 7:09 pm

STX doesn't really have to prove anything to you. He said he was a ham and then asked a question.

Perhaps he did this to fit in when asking the question. I'm involved in the local club but I'm not a ham, when we go out to big events I let people assume I'm a ham because if I don't they think im breaking the radiocommunications act by talking to them face to face.

Who cares who he claimed to be, i doubt its because he has out standing warrents? he just typed something in when asking questions on an internet web site. Just like people say they are 20 when they are 19 and 10 months old.

He hasn't really done any real damage. And he shouldn't have to send you a photo copy of his birth certif. just so he can be a good guy in yours eyes.

Nickdap · Post by **Nickdap** » Sat Aug 02, 2003 7:11 pm

Oh and how is this abusing our trust?

STX 821 wrote:i am not really big into the Ham Scene and i do have a 2 meter licsense but i never gotten around to asking what band is the World wide international Band?...and what is the Freq range on that?....and what radio would be a good radio to get to monitor it?...

k4wtf · Post by **k4wtf** » Sat Aug 02, 2003 7:41 pm

Nickdap wrote:Oh and how is this abusing our trust?

STX 821 wrote:i am not really big into the Ham Scene and i do have a 2 meter licsense but i never gotten around to asking what band is the World wide international Band?...and what is the Freq range on that?....and what radio would be a good radio to get to monitor it?...

If he doesn't have his ticket, and he lied to us, that is abusing our trust. It is that simple.

You are right though. He doesn't have to prove anything to me. Unless he does, I'll assume he's a liar though.

As for your supposition that he said he was a ham to "fit in"... Since when do you have to be a licensed amateur radio operator to have questions about HF propagation? There are many, MANY shortwave listeners who are very interested in propagation.

As for letting people "assume" you're a ham at events, that's just fine. You didn't TELL anyone you were a ham when while you AREN'T. Had STX 821 simply asked his question, and not claimed to have his ticket, I wouldn't be asking what his callsign was. He opened the door though. He claimed to have his ticket and I want to know what his callsign is.

So, STX 821... Which is it? Do you have a callsign or were you lieing to us?

--
John

Nickdap · Post by **Nickdap** » Sat Aug 02, 2003 8:13 pm

John,

I think some people out there feel as though they have to meet some kinda of expectation when interacting with people who know more about something then they do. Anyway you are right, you shouldn't lie at anytime. I'm just not all that worried about the violation of my trust on such a simple thing. But on the other hand if everyone were truthful all the time I could have a radio sent to me check it out and then send payment with out fear of getting cheated.

Anyway I'm out of two cent pieces.

Regards,
Nick

k4wtf · Post by **k4wtf** » Sat Aug 02, 2003 8:44 pm

Nickdap wrote:John,

I think some people out there feel as though they have to meet some kinda of expectation when interacting with people who know more about something then they do.

But, they DON'T. That is what is wonderful about interacting with other people! Everyone knows more about SOMETHING than other people do. When people want advice on dynamic routing protocols and configuring routers, they come to me. If they come to me and ask me about encryption, I'm going to refer them to a friend of mine. If they ask me about building race engines, I'll refer them to another friend. I am involved with all of the above but, at least in my circle, I'm only considered an authority on one.

When someone has a question, they should simply ask it. That's what brought me to the Batboard. I had questions about programming my Sabers. I *thought* I had a handle on things but, as I found out, there was a better way to do things. I now have a stable programming platform (Thanks Monty!) and beyond that, I have some new friends who *all* know more about something that I know.

Had I come in here claiming to be something I wasn't, I don't think that would be the case.

Anyway you are right, you shouldn't lie at anytime. I'm just not all that worried about the violation of my trust on such a simple thing.

I guess I'm hyper sensative about these things. If someone lies to me about such a simple thing, can I ever trust them with ANYTHING? Perhaps it's a Marine thing. Perhaps it's a military thing. Perhaps it's a LEO thing. Maybe a combination of all of them. Someone could take every material thing I have and I would still have my integrity. My peers and my clients all know that I'll tell them the truth, even when it is terribly embarrassing. What has my occasional red-faced embarrassment bought me? Loyal friends and clients.

But on the other hand if everyone were truthful all the time I could have a radio sent to me check it out and then send payment with out fear of getting cheated.

Anyway I'm out of two cent pieces.

Regards,
Nick

There are some people I would do that with. That reminds me. I think I owe Monty some money. Have to check the paypal account and make sure I paid him!

Have a good night Nick.

STX 821: No harm, no foul man. If you don't have a ticket, no biggie. If you do, that's great. I was just currious. If you had come forward with a callsign I could verify, I was going to send you a receiver that would get you started listening to HF. Your original question indicated that you did not have a receiver of your own. It was the one that my elmer gave to me but, alas, it has been given to a new ham locally (today) with the condition that he will take care of it and either GIVE it to another new ham when the time comes or give it back to me when he's done with it.

73, John - K4WTF

k4wtf · Post by **k4wtf** » Sat Aug 02, 2003 9:49 pm

r0f wrote:Sorry to say, but it's the jerkhole attitude from the older hams like you guys, that is scaring off any new interest in amateur radio. When people who are NEW to radio get slammed for things they don't even know offends you, they're less likely to want to key up and have a conversation with you guys.

Jerkhole? That's a new one. I'm not "older" in my opinion but, I have been a ham for 15 years. As for people who are "NEW" being slammed for things they don't would offend me, lets get something straight. It truely takes a LOT to offend me and I don't "SLAM" people. If someone is in violation of the standards established by the repeater owner and I'm one of the trusties of that repeater, I'll inform them of their infraction and request that they refrain from repeating that infraction. If they're in violation of Part 97, I will do one of two things. (1) Shut down the repeater - generally gets their attention, and then make contact via telephone, email, US mail, the next time I hear them on the air, whatever it takes and let them know what it was that caused the repeater to be shut down and request that they not do that on the repeater any further. (2) If they're not doing something VERY stupid, I'll simply identify myself, inform them that they're in violation and request that they not do i t any further. This is not "SLAMMING" them. This is protecting the interest of the repeater owner and its trusties as well as attempting to protect the license of the person who is actually in violation. I don't expect everyone to be perfect. Hell, I've personally been in violation. Does this make me a bad operator? I don't think so. It makes me human.

Now, if you're referring to my not having any use for a liar, that is a different story. I'd rather have someone punch me in the face than lie to me. I just flat out can't stand a liar.

Personally, I can't wait for the old dinosaur idiot hams to die off, so the new folk can start experimenting with things, and CHANGE the OLD CRAP that people like you guys carry on for decades.

Excuse me? That's kinda harsh don't you think? What is it that you want to experiment with that you can't? What "OLD CRAP" do you want to change that people like "us guys" carry on for decades?

Who wants to get on the repeater with some guy who can barely hold a sentence, without his dentures falling out?

I do. As a matter of fact, until last year, I did at least once a week. His name was Bill. He was "abandoned" by his family in a nursing home. Some amateurs in Dayton smuggled an HT into him so that he could at least get on the air. We were his link to the outside world. He made it a point to learn the name of EVERY person he talked to and absolutely amazed me many times with his ability to remember the fine details of a conversation we had had weeks earlier. He cared about all of us and it showed. It was sometimes hard to understand what he said on the air but, he wasn't offended if we asked him to repeat. Bill became a silent key and will truely be missed by at least those of us who took the time to get to know him. Oh, by the way, Bill was 60 years older than me and NEVER ONCE "SLAMMED" me or any of the "no-code" amateurs he was interacting with on the air.

Who wants to talk on HF, when some old retired know-it-all slams you for not using "proper" operating technique? Who the hell are you guys?

Oh... I get it. You've been "corrected" and didn't take kindly to it. Are you the type of guy who gets mad because someone says something to you when you tune up on the air VS into a dummy load? The kinda guy who tries to call his buddies on the local repeater in the middle of a directed net? It doesn't matter that you weren't using proper operating technique... All that matters is that some "old fart" corrected you on the air. Who the hell does he think he is to correct you? I mean, you took your test, you paid your license fees, you bought your radio - you can use it ANY DAMNED WAY YOU WANT!!! Sorry Shuan, it doesn't work that way and if the "old farts" are driving people who think it does away from Amateur Radio, I applaud them for doing so.

FYI, the "Basic" license in Canada = 2M CB license as far as I'm concerned. For you to pretend it isn't, just shows you how stupid you are. The Technician license is the same thing - it's an entry level ticket. Welcome the new people to the hobby, and help them along the way. Don't be such a prick all the time you guys!

Shaun - VE4UO

OK. Lets get something straight here. I have made no previous assumptions about your knowledge or lack thereof. For you to call me, or anyone else stupid is not only impolite but foolish.

And as for the "Basic" and "Technicians" class licenses being a "2M CB license," they certainly are not and if you think that they are, no wonder you are receiving a less than warm welcome from more mature amateur radio operators.

--
John

Cowthief · Post by **Cowthief** » Sat Aug 02, 2003 10:58 pm

Hello.

I agree, a lot of hams give everybody a hard time, to prove they are "the man".
You can get hell, yes, but,AFAIK, the only person who has asked in open forun who was a ham on batboard, was, I.
A large number of batboarders are hams, a lot are not.
The visit to the Hamvention was a clear example of working with everybody, as MURS and GMRS channels were in use as well as the ham bands.
I spent most of my time with the green radio bunch, a fair number are hams, a fair number come from countries where a green radio could get your head chopped off.
Why do we fool with green radios, for a lot of the same reasons we play with motorola, and there is no "right" answer.
Lets face it, there are a lot of bad people who would love to cause trouble, and I would like to stay away from them, last thing I need is to explain something because a "friend" said something.
Trust, something very fragile indeed, once it is broken, you never get another one, (Islamic proverb).

Doug · Post by **Doug** » Sun Aug 03, 2003 2:51 am

OK...., anybody up for a topic change? How about politics or religion next.
I've got only one more question to ask and it's directed to John... K4WTF. How in the world do you ever find anything in your shack? A picture speaks a thousand words

You don't actually do projects in there do you?
Enjoy the day all
Doug...N9JSF

Nickdap · Post by **Nickdap** » Sun Aug 03, 2003 3:05 am

Thanks John, looks like we are on the same wave length.

Anyway after looking at Johns website, looks like he knows what he is doing. Love the clocks.

Oh and when I started out in this hobby a ham friend gave me a scanner and wow it's things like that which will help ham radio out. Wish I could get one of those old valve motorolas and put it in some kinda of 12.5 filter lol. Would look cool in my 97 vectra....anyway thats for another thread.

Regards,
Nick

k4wtf · Post by **k4wtf** » Sun Aug 03, 2003 4:33 am

I actually *did* build the K2 + KPA100 in the shack. In the area where the map is, I set up a 6ft x 6ft table and went to town. I built the KAT100 upstairs on the diningroom table though. I guess it just depends on what mood I'm in where I build things. I wasn't thinking too terribly clearly about finding itty-bitty parts I may drop when I chose the black carpet for the basement so, for very involved things or component level work, it's usually at the office or upstairs somewhere. I went with the black carpet because I wanted to mute ALL light reflection from the floor to enhance the video display.

Anyway, wife is telling me we've got to go. I'll post more later.

--
John

kf4sqb · Post by **kf4sqb** » Sun Aug 03, 2003 10:26 am

Where are all you people at? I got my origianal ticket at the age of 21 in 1997, because of the help of all the "old farts" in my area! I have yet to meet but a few people on the bands (HF, VHF, or UHF) who act like the people ya'll are describing. Most of the "older" HAMs I've ever met, face to face or on the air, have been very helpful and very courteous to me and everyone else (who is being civil!) who were around. I have heard some people tell others that they were doing something "wrong", and even been corrected myself at times, as well as correcting others from time to time. A true HAM in that situation will either (a): admit they are wrong and that they knew better, and try to correct the problem, or (b): admit that they weren't aware that they were doing wrong, and try to correct the problem. On the other hand, a "licensed CB'er" is the one who usually takes offence when corrected and starts talking about how bad "old farts" and "rule-book thumpers" are to them, when they were simply trying to correct a problem and keep the art of HAM radio working as it should. I personaly welcome criticism of my operating habits, as it keeps me on my toes and keeps me from slacking off. As for wheather or not STX 821 has a license: who cares? There is nothing in the FCC rules that says you can't listen to HF without a licecse. On the other hand, if he doesn't have a license, why say he did. I, for one, would have been just as happy to give the info to a non-HAM as a HAM. Anyhow, I've had the soapbox long enough for now. 73!

Nand · Post by **Nand** » Sun Aug 03, 2003 12:54 pm

STX 821 wrote:i am not really big into the Ham Scene and i do have a 2 meter licsense but i never gotten around to asking what band is the World wide international Band?...and what is the Freq range on that?....and what radio would be a good radio to get to monitor it?...

"STX 821" is Jay Spinilli (illnino1107@yahoo.com) and does not appear to hold a valid amateur radio call sign at this time according to http://www.QRZ.com.

Sorry Jay, I love search engines…

Nand.

Cowthief · Post by **Cowthief** » Sun Aug 03, 2003 1:33 pm

Hello.

I have to agree.
The old farts I have meet, growing up, helped me a great deal.
My "parents" were society's trash, to put it mildly.
Several hams helped me record the household noise.
This gave me the evidence to get myself declared an orphan, turns out later I was one all along.
My primary means of contact with people at large was a table-top radio that had an entire RX-TX section inside, a WWII vet helped me put it together.
I got my ham ticket, learned to fly, drive, scuba dive, sky dive, all from old farts.
You see, my only real father figures were the old farts.
Do you think a yuppie would take the time to teach an orphan kid, or 118?

k4wtf · Post by **k4wtf** » Sun Aug 03, 2003 2:18 pm

Nand wrote:
STX 821 wrote:i am not really big into the Ham Scene and i do have a 2 meter licsense but i never gotten around to asking what band is the World wide international Band?...and what is the Freq range on that?....and what radio would be a good radio to get to monitor it?...
"STX 821" is Jay Spinilli (illnino1107@yahoo.com) and does not appear to hold a valid amateur radio call sign at this time according to http://www.QRZ.com.

Sorry Jay, I love search engines…

Nand.

For that matter, a search of ULS and CORES comes up with a big fat goose egg when it comes to licenses. Heck, there isn't a single license of ANY kind issued to *ANYONE* with the last name Spinilli.

No GMRS, no commercial, no amateur, nada, zilch.

This one is beutiful...

STX 821 on twowayshopper wrote: I am looking to Get 4 STX radios Programed (2 STX 800 and 2 STX 821 radios) also i need to know if they have a roger beep that can be programmed?..Please email me Illnino1107@yahoo.com
Jay <Illnino1107@yahoo.com>
CA USA - Monday, June 02, 2003 at 15:46:24 (EDT)

Roger beep. Ya... 10-4 good buddy.

And this one is even better...

STX 821 on twowayshopper wrote: Looking for a Cheaper used Repeater to go along with 25 STX 800 radios I am looking for a 16 channels Repeater that is conventional only...if you can help me please email me with a Reasonable price
Jay <illnino1107@yahoo.com>
CA USA - Tuesday, June 10, 2003 at 13:08:54 (EDT)

So, tell us Jay. Which non-existant license are you using those 800Mhz radios and repeater with?

Ever get around that BIOS password issue on the used "UP-TECH" computer?

http://www.experts-exchange.com/Securit ... 42397.html

Try this one: "Liar"

You never know. It just might work.

Gawd, I hate being right when it comes to things like this.

--
John

wa2zdy · Post by **wa2zdy** » Sun Aug 03, 2003 3:28 pm

"i have for Sale the Following..i am interested in trading but will sell: NIB Alinco DJ-195R VHF with Professionally Modified Freq Range of 130.0000mhz-173.9950mhz...you can TX on any Freqs that you need in this band. it has 40 built in tones and 104 DCS tones, it has 5,10,12.5,15,20,25 and 30Khz channel spacing and Encode and Decode on the DCS and TSQ tones. This radio has 40 channels and 1 call channel and is CAP modifies as well. it has many many more options and comes NIB used mabey 10 hours total with no scrathes in Perfect condition and all is well with all aspects of the radio. i also have an STX 800 Inst Safe with Inst safe batteyr 2 chargers 2 antennas and 1 Inst Safe battery and 2 non inst safe batterys and Public saftery mic..Model # for the Radio is H35WKA5170BN..This is a SmartNet radio with 989 conventional channels and all sorts of options...please email me if interested in trading.... i am looking for a Dual Band Ham VHF/UHF with VHF/UHF RX range for PS...or i am looking for a UHF Radio like this one by Alinco...i am open to many trades...please email me if interested
Jay <Illnino1107@yahoo.com>
CA USA - Monday, July 07, 2003 at 17:14:55 (EDT)"

I wonder if he ever sold that professionally modified HAM radio? LOL!!!! Classic.

I have nothing against newbies, only against liars. And to lie for no reason? Makes you wonder what else he lies about. Might be worth remembering he lies when buying? Oh I dunno, I'm sure he only lies when it doesn't matter.

Proud to be a RULEBOOK thumping law abiding citizen.

k4wtf · Post by **k4wtf** » Sun Aug 03, 2003 6:43 pm

STX 821 in his for sale ad wrote: NIB Alinco DJ-195R VHF with Professionally Modified Freq Range of 130.0000mhz-173.9950mhz...

blah...blah...

...and comes NIB used mabey 10 hours total with no scrathes in Perfect condition and all is well with all aspects of the radio.

Hrm... Am I mistaken or is NIB the common convention for "NEW IN BOX?" I'm wondering how it was "Professionally Modified" and then used for 10 hours while still maintaining that NIB status?

wa2zdy wrote: I wonder if he ever sold that professionally modified HAM radio? LOL!!!! Classic.

Yep. You've got to wonder.

wa2zdy wrote: Proud to be a RULEBOOK thumping law abiding citizen.

You know it!

--
John

nmfire10 · Post by **nmfire10** » Mon Aug 04, 2003 3:09 am

I had the distinct feeling that he was full of it just by the way he asked it and then dissapeared once questioned. I decided to save it until someone found his name and looked up a call sign.

Well, maye this mope and VHFRADIO/ Tommy Sherman can get togerther. I think they would get along well. Duh-Heyuck.

To Mr STX.... People on this board are not morons (well, most people anyway). We can usually see BS a mile away. When something isn't right, people here have a tendency to do thier own checking around to see if you are legit. This is not the first time either. Names, addresses, call signs, and every add and post you make are publicly available and it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that you are lying weasel. You have no buinsness with any of this stuff as far as I am concerned. Find a new hobby.

wx4cbh · Post by **wx4cbh** » Tue Aug 05, 2003 8:05 pm

Well, I may be new to this forum, but I can see already there are people here who have some hostilities toward us "no-coders." Why did I get into amateur radio? Because I'm involved in the search side of an urban search and rescue organization, and one of the requirements to be a member of this group is a minimum of a no-code license. I decided that was a small "price" to pay for opening up an even larger world of volunteerism. Besides, most of the crowd I hang with are also emergency services people with ham tickets, many of them Extra classers. And yaeh, they're always on my "hams" to move up.

As I came to this ham business during my 30+ years as a Batwing tech, I discovered how much fun can be had pursuing things like ARES/RACES and Skywarn activities. All these other clowns I hang out with were doing these ham radio things and having too much fun for me to continue to pass it all up, so with their help I took the plunge.

I am a no-coder and don't really intend to go for the code in the near future. I LIKE the 6 meter & up activities and that's enough for the time being. In another part of the country, I might feel differently about that, but I don't put people down for their preferences in the band/license class divisions. I for one love to listen to the HF bands on my Drake receiver, especially the emergency nets, and I do not support the dropping of code speed requirements to just 5 WPM. In light of the rumors of the demise of code altogether, I feel that code should be a special endorsement for general and above, and that the code bands should be preserved for those who wish to participate, and that the endorsement requirement should be at least the old 13 WPM.

Soon after I got my vanity call, one of the local bags of flatulence displayed his arrogance and ignorance by telling me to get off the club repeater because my call sign was "invalid." Despite the fact that he is one of the individuals in ham radio who thinks anyone who can't do at least 30 WPM is unworthy of breathing, let alone hold a ham license, and despite the fact that he can always find time to jawjack on any frequency he pleases but can't be found when there's an ARES activation, and despite the fact that he never participates in any club activities but can always show up at monthly meetings to spout vitriolic phrases at those who don't think like he does, HE DOESN'T REPRESENT ME AS A HAM. I am also tired of tolerating ratchet-jawing no-coder hacks who obviously got into ham radio because they wanted to be a "Super CBer." They give absolutely nothing to the hobby and don't represent me as a ham either.

All of us got into this ham thing for different reasons, but the bottom line is that you can't play unless you pay. Sometimes you have to give back something for the privilege of using the frequencies. One of those things might be the old seemingly forgotten practice of "Elmering." That's how I got here.

I also strongly feel that the exams should be made much tougher for all classes, and that all who want to become hams should have to attend some kind of classes that would teach them radio ettiquette as well as what the microphone and the keyer is to be used for. And I very strongly feel that the question pools should NOT be available to the "memorizers." Anyone who really wants anything badly enough will do what's required to achieve the goal. Yes, I am a no-coder, but I don't think the road to it in 1991 was rough enough to be a weeding process, and yes, I did have a leg-up as a tech in getting my license.

Thanx for letting me shine the rails and blow the whistle a bit.

wx4cbh · Post by **wx4cbh** » Tue Aug 05, 2003 8:10 pm

wx4cbh wrote:Well, I may be new to this forum, but I can see already there are people here who have some hostilities toward us "no-coders." Why did I get into amateur radio? Because I'm involved in the search side of an urban search and rescue organization, and one of the requirements to be a member of this group is a minimum of a no-code license. I decided that was a small "price" to pay for opening up an even larger world of volunteerism. Besides, most of the crowd I hang with are also emergency services people with ham tickets, many of them Extra classers. And yaeh, they're always on my "hams" to move up.

As I came to this ham business during my 30+ years as a Batwing tech, I discovered how much fun can be had pursuing things like ARES/RACES and Skywarn activities. All these other clowns I hang out with were doing these ham radio things and having too much fun for me to continue to pass it all up, so with their help I took the plunge.

I am a no-coder and don't really intend to go for the code in the near future. I LIKE the 6 meter & up activities and that's enough for the time being. In another part of the country, I might feel differently about that, but I don't put people down for their preferences in the band/license class divisions. I for one love to listen to the HF bands on my Drake receiver, especially the emergency nets, and I do not support the dropping of code speed requirements to just 5 WPM. In light of the rumors of the demise of code altogether, I feel that code should be a special endorsement for general and above, and that the code bands should be preserved for those who wish to participate, and that the endorsement requirement should be at least the old 13 WPM.

Soon after I got my vanity call, one of the local bags of flatulence displayed his arrogance and ignorance by telling me to get off the club repeater because my call sign was "invalid." Despite the fact that he is one of the individuals in ham radio who thinks anyone who can't do at least 30 WPM is unworthy of breathing, let alone hold a ham license, and despite the fact that he can always find time to jawjack on any frequency he pleases but can't be found when there's an ARES activation, and despite the fact that he never participates in any club activities but can always show up at monthly meetings to spout vitriolic phrases at those who don't think like he does, HE DOESN'T REPRESENT ME AS A HAM. I am also tired of tolerating ratchet-jawing no-coder hacks who obviously got into ham radio because they wanted to be a "Super CBer." They give absolutely nothing to the hobby and don't represent me as a ham either.

All of us got into this ham thing for different reasons, but the bottom line is that you can't play unless you pay. Sometimes you have to give back something for the privilege of using the frequencies. One of those things might be the old seemingly forgotten practice of "Elmering." That's how I got here.

I also strongly feel that the exams should be made much tougher for all classes, and that all who want to become hams should have to attend some kind of classes that would teach them radio ettiquette as well as what the microphone and the keyer is to be used for. And I very strongly feel that the question pools should NOT be available to the "memorizers." Anyone who really wants anything badly enough will do what's required to achieve the goal. Yes, I am a no-coder, but I don't think the road to it in 1991 was rough enough to be a weeding process, and yes, I did have a leg-up as a tech in getting my license.

Since ham radio is "self-policing", it takes a questioning attitude to keep this hobby what it is, in spite of 75 meters. Maybe it just takes a little discretion. Oh well.

Thanx for letting me shine the rails and blow the whistle a bit.

Cowthief · Post by **Cowthief** » Tue Aug 05, 2003 9:34 pm

Hello.

I can see no issue about code vs non-code.
The statement was he is a ham.
Yes, I agree, some hams are vary hard to get along with.
I have a very old motorola radio, runs on the old AM band to 160 meters.
A few friends and I wanted to do living history, and do some mock period police traffic.
After passing this around the ham community in Houston, I cought hell.
Some hams were saying it was broadcasting, and against the rules, others telling the police I was trying to put a radio on current police channels, several people called the FCC.
In the end, the FCC was the most helpful, getting me the OK to put it on the old cordless phone channels (1.8MHz).
I have since made a large number of friends in the police department.
It would be strange for me not to put a radio on the current radio channels now.
But, then, like now, it was being honest that helped me.
It is no big deal to have a ham call, almost everybody I know on the radio now is not a ham, be that police, fire, GMRS, CB, whatever.
But, if you say you are,,,.
KA5PIU.

World Wide ham bands...what Freq and radios?

World Wide ham bands...what Freq and radios?

Re: World Wide ham bands...what Freq and radios?

Re: World Wide ham bands...what Freq and radios?

Ham

HAMster

Re: HAMster = The OTHER white meat!

Re: World Wide ham bands...what Freq and radios?

Re: World Wide ham bands...what Freq and radios?

Hams and honesty

Re: World Wide ham bands...what Freq and radios?

Old Farts

Re: World Wide ham bands...what Freq and radios?

Code.