PR1500 radio problems, looking for an answer, im stumped

dawson75 · Post by **dawson75** » Sun Jul 30, 2006 10:12 pm

Recently the Hospital I work at ordered new radios for the security department ( 25,000 worth to be exact from staleys ) they are UHF PR1500's. Here is the problem we are having. Compared to the P1225's we used to use there is a noticeable "echo " when standing nearby another radio kinda like a digital 800mhz system would do .. did not have that with the p1225's ( probally not a big deal ). The big problem is every now and then the radios ( not just one ) will not TX ( you can hear it on the bases that are directly connected to the repeater via telephone line ) but you cant hear them on the some other portables ( some of them RX some dont ). This problem happends with all the radios not just one and thats what is stumping me . Im thinking its a signaling issue, or a programming issue if it was a repeater issue wouldnt it effect all the radios at the same time?

Just trying to figure out whats going on

Thanks guys

Dan

Post by **wavetar** » Mon Jul 31, 2006 8:38 am

The 'echo' you are hearing is normal for the PR1500, as the audio goes through a D/A conversion just like the digital radios (XTS1500/2500/5000), even though it's an analog-only radio.

The 'dropping audio' is another issue. The portables are obviously transmitting the audio, as you can hear it on the repeater remotes everytime. So, it's a matter of why it doesn't seem to be keying the repeater, or if it's keying the repeater, why it isn't being received by all radios. Are you using any PL/DPL on the repeater? That would be the first thing I'd look at, making sure the correct PL/DPL is being used, and also that the levels both the portables & repeater are putting out are within spec.

Todd

precoislen · Post by **precoislen** » Mon Jul 31, 2006 10:32 am

wavetar wrote:The 'echo' you are hearing is normal for the PR1500, as the audio goes through a D/A conversion just like the digital radios (XTS1500/2500/5000), even though it's an analog-only radio.

Is that the same thing for the analog MT1500's also? I understand that they are basically a "dumbed" down version of the XTS1500.

Post by **Firebuff66** » Mon Jul 31, 2006 5:43 pm

All the radios MT1500 PR1500 XTS1500 are the excat same radio just diffrent options the MT & PR can be made a XTS with a flash of the radio
Same with the PM1500 its an XTS without digital, but 110watts and remote mount, so if you want high power digital with remote mount buy the PM1500 and flash it for digital.

dawson75 · Post by **dawson75** » Mon Jul 31, 2006 8:15 pm

the pl is 103.5

any how i was thinkin maybe the portables are not getting the pl fast enough or just not getting it at all. the repeater is old same age as the 1225's were id say around 10. to 12 years. im not sure what the problem is but i just think its bad for us seeings how its our safety thats on the line.

thanks for the info ill pass it on to the appropriate folks at the hospital.

Thanks
Dan

Post by **wavetar** » Tue Aug 01, 2006 4:49 am

precoislen wrote:
wavetar wrote:The 'echo' you are hearing is normal for the PR1500, as the audio goes through a D/A conversion just like the digital radios (XTS1500/2500/5000), even though it's an analog-only radio.

Is that the same thing for the analog MT1500's also? I understand that they are basically a "dumbed" down version of the XTS1500.

Yes, all radios built on the Astro25 platform treat audio exactly the same way...it is processed through the DSP circuitry regardless of whether or not the end resulting audio is destined to be analog or digital.

Todd

tvsjr · Post by **tvsjr** » Tue Aug 01, 2006 6:49 am

And expect to see more of this happening as digital becomes more popular and as more and more RF filtering and processing is moved from discrete components into DSP.

As far as some units not hearing the repeater output, I'd look into the tones. The Astro25 platform is *tight* when it comes to PL. My throwdown portable repeater with a TS32 for tone encode worked perfectly with all of my radios, up to my XTS3000s. Try it with an XTS5000, and the tolerance is just too sloppy. I've yet to sit down and fix that little problem. Someone with the appropriate test equipment and at least one clue should be able to tell you if this is indeed the problem.

dawson75 · Post by **dawson75** » Wed Aug 02, 2006 7:49 pm

Just to give you guys an update , the local moto dealer came and tested all the radio's and all the radios tested within spec's. The tech seems to think that the radios are a bad batch from motorola. Since these radios are brand new they are going to be replaced.

Never heard of 25 radios being bad from the factory but i guess it could happen.

Thanks for all the helpful info guys really appritiate it.

Dan

Bruce1807 · Post by **Bruce1807** » Wed Aug 02, 2006 7:56 pm

I'd love to know what version firmware they are running.

dawson75 · Post by **dawson75** » Sat Aug 05, 2006 8:53 pm

i dont know if you can find out the firmware or not by this info but here is what i got off of the tags

model: AAH795DC9PW5AN

FLASH: 000001-00200-5

H35/G48 Conventional Operation
Q241 ASTRO Ready (Analog Operation ONLY)

Motorola is sticking by its claim that all the radios are bad.

just out of curiousity i had the guys go to channel 2 ( simplex channel ) Radios worked perfectly but seeings how the remotes are directly conected to the repeater our "dispatcher" could not hear us. So im beginning to think that it may be a reapeater problem. I guess we will find out with the new batch of radios.

dawson75 · Post by **dawson75** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 1:43 pm

just an update that is long overdue , It was a repeater issue with the PL programming seems as though the old repeater is forgiving if the specs are off a little but the radios are not. techs came in adjusted the repeater and all is well. Now we are having coverage issues. Where we could go with the old radios and rx and tx fine we are now having difficulty rx and tx in those areas. The safety admin are ordering a new reapeater so hopefully the issues will be worked out.

Thanks for the info guys

Dan

Vercomm · Post by **Vercomm** » Thu Feb 01, 2007 12:10 am

You will want to check out FSB10044, this is covered under warranty. This is regarding the PL issue with the Astro25 Family radios. Below is a copy of the FSB from Motorola.

SUBJECT:
XTS/XTL/MT/PM 1500, 2500, 5000 and ASTRO Spectra Plus – Intermittent PL Decode
MODELS / SYSTEMS AFFECTED:
All XTS2500/5000, XTS/MT/PR1500, XTL2500/5000, XTL/PM 1500 family radio using ONLY Host R08.01.03 firmware
utilizing the TPL feature are potentially affected. Radios utilizing DPL are not affected.
SYMPTOM:
There are a few possible scenarios where the problem will be exhibited.
1) The radio properly decodes the first PL call. If the PL then drops, the radio will mute as expected. However, when the
PL is reestablished the radio will not unmute even though the call has the correct PL. Changing the channel or mode
switch will correct this issue and the radio will correctly unmute to appropriate PL code.
2) The units will not open to traffic on the repeater channel unless they are in Scan mode. (Again this is similar to a channel
change or mode switch which causes the radio to properly unmute to PL again.)
3) Receive a good carrier with the correct PL signal. The radio would unmute as expected. If the PL is then switched to a
different PL, the subscriber would mute as expected. If the PL is then switched back to the correct PL, the subscriber
would not re-qualify the signal and remained muted.
CAUSE:
Firmware defect in the radio.
RESOLUTION:
Upgrade radio firmware to R09.00.00 or later.
The release R09.00.00 software upgrade kit can be ordered at no charge by entering the requested data in ALL fields of the
following Software Refresher Order form (last page of this document) and emailing it to the System Support Center.
SEVERITY RECOMMENDATION:
High - Perform Immediately if TPL is used.

Post by **BlueLineEnt** » Sun Jun 19, 2011 10:19 am

Vercomm wrote:You will want to check out FSB10044, this is covered under warranty. This is regarding the PL issue with the Astro25 Family radios. Below is a copy of the FSB from Motorola.

SUBJECT:
XTS/XTL/MT/PM 1500, 2500, 5000 and ASTRO Spectra Plus – Intermittent PL Decode
MODELS / SYSTEMS AFFECTED:
All XTS2500/5000, XTS/MT/PR1500, XTL2500/5000, XTL/PM 1500 family radio using ONLY Host R08.01.03 firmware
utilizing the TPL feature are potentially affected. Radios utilizing DPL are not affected.
SYMPTOM:
There are a few possible scenarios where the problem will be exhibited.
1) The radio properly decodes the first PL call. If the PL then drops, the radio will mute as expected. However, when the
PL is reestablished the radio will not unmute even though the call has the correct PL. Changing the channel or mode
switch will correct this issue and the radio will correctly unmute to appropriate PL code.
2) The units will not open to traffic on the repeater channel unless they are in Scan mode. (Again this is similar to a channel
change or mode switch which causes the radio to properly unmute to PL again.)
3) Receive a good carrier with the correct PL signal. The radio would unmute as expected. If the PL is then switched to a
different PL, the subscriber would mute as expected. If the PL is then switched back to the correct PL, the subscriber
would not re-qualify the signal and remained muted.
CAUSE:
Firmware defect in the radio.
RESOLUTION:
Upgrade radio firmware to R09.00.00 or later.
The release R09.00.00 software upgrade kit can be ordered at no charge by entering the requested data in ALL fields of the
following Software Refresher Order form (last page of this document) and emailing it to the System Support Center.
SEVERITY RECOMMENDATION:
High - Perform Immediately if TPL is used.

Does anyone know if they are having similar problems again with Firmware 14.00.01? I have an XTS1500 with that firmware that is exhibiting problems exactly like symptom #2. Also, does anyone know what the latest firmware would be for this radio currently?

d119 · Post by **d119** » Sun Jun 19, 2011 8:32 pm

Latest version would be R15.00.09. Haven't heard of this in R14.00.01.

kb9suy · Post by **kb9suy** » Mon Jun 20, 2011 2:31 pm

We noticed this problem with you xts5000 on one of our uhf ham repeaters. We had to increase the PL deviation for it to open our pls.

chartofmaryland · Post by **chartofmaryland** » Tue Jun 21, 2011 10:32 am

What is the repeater output frequency in use?

If it is near 462.000 this would be a self quieting issue with the product line. the PR thru XTS all have this and would exhibit a situation near what you are experiencing where when the PR is close enough to the transmitter the RF level is high enough to overcome the internal quieting and audio is heard walk away from the station and no audio.

West Virginia state system chose 462.000 as HELO 1 which kept the users from being able to talk to a chopper for an LZ.

CoM

Post by **BlueLineEnt** » Wed Jun 22, 2011 9:01 pm

It is occurring radio wide, through all the channels, with the lowest being 453.xxxx up to 486.xxxx

PR1500 radio problems, looking for an answer, im stumped

PR1500 radio problems, looking for an answer, im stumped

1500

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Re: PR1500 radio problems, looking for an answer, im stumped

Re: PR1500 radio problems, looking for an answer, im stumped

Re: PR1500 radio problems, looking for an answer, im stumped

Re: PR1500 radio problems, looking for an answer, im stumped