PRO-96---It's Great!

ASTROMODAT · Post by **ASTROMODAT** » Tue Sep 16, 2003 6:44 pm

The receiver sounds very nearly as good as our XTS 3000 radios, although the few hundred milliwattts of audio power just doesn't cut it when you are out doors, and/or in a car at speed. Nevertheless, I'm very pleased with the quality of the recovered IMBE audio. There is no tuning required for IMBE reception, as there is with the P25 Uniden. A cost effective way for quick radio checks, as opposed to needing another ASTRO receiver.

Larry

Post by **batdude** » Tue Sep 16, 2003 6:50 pm

it's the new astro-tac "budget model" remote site receiver...

hey... if it decodes, then it converts to analog fm....

hmmmm

now i need the pro-96 astro-tac comparator model

$500 is a lot cheaper than $10k

lol

doug

mancow · Post by **mancow** » Tue Sep 16, 2003 6:52 pm

Have you seen that Uniden is coming out with a BC296d hand held that looks just like the 250d?

The decoder card is supposed to be included.

mancow

ASTROMODAT · Post by **ASTROMODAT** » Tue Sep 16, 2003 6:57 pm

Knowing RS, give them about 6 months and it will probably be about $199.

I still can't get over how an el cheapo radio can sound so darn good in IMBE! The sensitivity appears to be roughly on a par with the XTS 3000 (anecdotal observations/first impressions only!), albeit I'm sure the selectivity sucks. Haven't had it in an RF congested environment yet since I just received it today, so we'll see...

Larry

mancow · Post by **mancow** » Tue Sep 16, 2003 7:03 pm

That's good to hear!

There isn't much (if anything) using digital around here so I suppose I will save my bucks. I kind of wish there was so I would have a new toy to pursue.

If the 96 receiver is based on the 93 in any way then I can see how it works so well. I still can't believe the sensitivity of my 93 on 800. It took on the MTS2000 and held its own just fine.

mancow

ASTROMODAT · Post by **ASTROMODAT** » Tue Sep 16, 2003 7:09 pm

Yeah, I saw the specs on the new Uniden. It appears that Uniden is trying to quickly modify their existing unit in order to respond to Tandy's 9600 baud unit. Uniden beat everyone with the first P25 scanner, and I bet by next Christmas they will make the PRO-96 look like child's play. My guess is that in the end, Uniden will prevail. RS has the edge since their radio was introduced nearly a year after Uniden hit the market with the first IMBE scanner. Problem is that Uniden still has the weird IMBE tuning requirement, and it doesn't store 5,500 IDs and freqs, like the PRO-96 does.

The PRO-96 has an internal database that stores many different trunking systems, so when you travel, it is simple to load in any given city's trunked info (I haven't had time to even explore this feature yet). You simply pull up the control channel freq, and it "finds" all of the active trunking freqs. Or, if you don't know the freq of even just the control channel, it will find it first, and then it will quickly hunt down all of the operating freqs. Or, if the control channel changes, it will find the new one, and then hunt down all of the operating freqs. In effect, you can set-up any city in minutes, so it's not yet clear to me why one even needs these files to be stored for various city's trunking systems. It also comes from the factory with the Top 100 Trunked cities loaded into its memory, with ID.s, too. Also, you can download updated DSP firmware (for free, no FLASport charges here!) off of the RS web site, as they make it available to provide performance improvements and new features. We'll see how well that works over time.

Larry

2wayfreq · Post by **2wayfreq** » Tue Sep 16, 2003 8:42 pm

Hi,
So..does this mean its in the stores already? I thought it would be a few more months. I have an AS3 UHF 450-520. I use it for GMRS and can listen to LAPD. Soon, City the of Riverside will be ASTRO.
But I know some of the "3 letter agencies" around the LA basin on VHF are in "clear astro" mode and not using the DES on all channels. I would rather get a Pro-96 than a VHF AS3 that will see limited 2 way use. That way, I have UHF,VHF and 800 ASTRO listening capabilty. Anyone know if it will recieve Ericsson Digital ProVoice? Thanks..

Post by Pj » Tue Sep 16, 2003 8:50 pm

The Pro-96 doesn't do LTR or let you scan for private calls on Edacs or M systems. That's the biggest complaint I hear so far.

Microwave Mike · Post by **Microwave Mike** » Wed Sep 17, 2003 11:41 am

The pro -96 scanner seems to work with our 9600 baud P-25 system here in Phoenix. It decodes the C4FM signals, however it WILL NOT decode the CQPSK signals. WE use both forms of modulation on this system. I was going to buy ten scanners for our news department but not now. It looks like the radio will now be XTS series radios and ASplus mobils.
Now I am going to have to talk with the city about programming.

mmn

Microwave Mike · Post by **Microwave Mike** » Wed Sep 17, 2003 12:47 pm

I know that the radio can be uploaded with new DSP software.
You would think that a scanner designed to work with the new P-25 systems would include the two modulation formats. I my world I can't count on what will be. I am not ready to spend all my budget on XTS's. I would like to use scanners. Come on Rat Shack. Get both modulation formats going.

mm

Dale Earnhardt · Post by **Dale Earnhardt** » Wed Sep 17, 2003 2:08 pm

yeah, I agree, it does get expensiveeeeeeeeee when just buy an xts or an astro just for monitoring only, then again I guess if you dont have a gf or wife, it dosent matter lol,

Hey do anybody know if they coming out with a mobile version?

ASTROMODAT · Post by **ASTROMODAT** » Wed Sep 17, 2003 9:46 pm

The soon-to-be-released P25 UNIDENs may be the ticket you're looking for, MM.

http://www.strongsignals.net/access/new ... entry=1161

ASTROMODAT · Post by **ASTROMODAT** » Wed Sep 17, 2003 9:53 pm

MM, it looks like it might be a horse race between RS and UNIDEN to support CQPSK. I knew there was a reason why I love Capitalism!

http://www.strongsignals.net/access/boa ... 6&num=1028

Larry

Microwave Mike · Post by **Microwave Mike** » Thu Sep 18, 2003 9:53 am

I hope that the new radio that support both modulation formats come out soon. I have to use the cap-ex before the end of the year. It will BE used for two XTS's or scanners. Next year I will budget for a ASplus for the news room. I have found that they make the best scanners.

mm

2wayfreq · Post by **2wayfreq** » Thu Sep 18, 2003 10:20 am

Hi,
Anyone know if it will support Ericsson Digital ProVoice? I know it will support the analog side. Riverside County,CA will go ericsson digital in a few years. I would probably get it anyway for the VHF/UHF/800 APCO reception.

Microwave Mike · Post by **Microwave Mike** » Thu Sep 18, 2003 10:28 am

NO!!! Your only choice is a LPE-200 flashed up for pro-voice. The Fed's should have NEVER matched funds for a NON P-25 system. Edacs is a great trunking system, but it should have been brought up to P-25 standards. That is why we have standards.
So much for agencies being able to talk to each other be the CAI.

mm

2wayfreq · Post by **2wayfreq** » Thu Sep 18, 2003 4:30 pm

Doh!!!
Oh well, i'll just get a deal on a Jaguar 700P when they go digital. It wont really be an issue for a few years yet. I'll either get the 96 or hold out for the new uniden offering.

waverider1445 · Post by **waverider1445** » Wed Oct 01, 2003 1:24 pm

Hamilton County Comm Center in Cincinnati, Ohio has just switched over to a 800mhz P25 system. The Uniden scanner will not follow the system due to it being a 9600 baud system. I have been told that the RS 96 will not follow the system either due to it being on a VSLEB type trunk. Does anyone knwo if they do receive this type pattern? The departments are also carrying XTS5000. I have been told that these units are factory capable of encryption and it can be programmed over the air to it. This cuts out reprogramming all of the radio indiviually. This P25 is all new to me and I don't have much experience with it.

Post by **Wowbagger** » Wed Oct 01, 2003 1:56 pm

The fact that a receiver that can demodulate C4FM cannot demodulate CQPSK is puzzling to me - that's what the "C" in CQPSK stands for - Compatible, as in "Compatible with C4FM".

The parameters of CQPSK were chosen so that at symbol time the signal looks just like C4FM - sure it looks different between symbol times but who cares? (specifically as viewed in I/Q space the C4FM signal stays on the unit circle while the CQPSK signal goes all over the place - it's really apparent if you look at the two signals on a vector signal analyzer or suitably equipped service monitor.)

So why the PRO-96 won't lock onto a CQPSK signal is a little beyond me, unless RS did something really dain-bramaged in their slicer code.

Anybody here who owns a Pro-96 near Wichita? I'd love to run a few tests.

Johnny Galaga · Post by **Johnny Galaga** » Fri Oct 03, 2003 4:43 pm

2wayfreq wrote:Doh!!!
Oh well, i'll just get a deal on a Jaguar 700P when they go digital. It wont really be an issue for a few years yet. I'll either get the 96 or hold out for the new uniden offering.

You do realize the EDACS version of the software you'll need is $2500 ?

ASTROMODAT · Post by **ASTROMODAT** » Fri Oct 10, 2003 2:15 pm

That's my point, rOf---I think a lot of folks who are spending $800 to $1,500 on ASTRO radios in order to monitor the Police would like the RS PRO-96 better. Its audio is every bit as good as an ASTRO Saber or XTS, albeit not quite as loud. And, since many/most folks are not authorized to transmit back anyway, I would think the PRO-96 is now the radio of choice, if one wants to monitor only. It's amazing to me how good the audio is. And, the price is supposed to be $399 by Thanksgiving.

Larry

Scott1563 · Post by **Scott1563** » Fri Oct 31, 2003 8:53 pm

How do you get the Pro 96 to listen to the talk groups you want, like Police and Fire and not other city services on the same freqs.

Scott

RocketNJ · Post by **RocketNJ** » Fri Oct 31, 2003 9:36 pm

I believe you need to enter the talkgroups you want to listen to then lock the bank.

Check out http://www.trunkedradio.net for the trunktracker scanner forum. Lots of good info.

George

Radio_Cowboy · Post by **Radio_Cowboy** » Sat Nov 01, 2003 2:28 pm

2wayfreq wrote:Doh!!!
Oh well, i'll just get a deal on a Jaguar 700P when they go digital.

Better hope that when Riverside goes to upgrade their EDACS system they don't implament the "Edacs System Key" or ESK feature. Basicially, this encrypts the control channel, and keeps unauthorized radios and even trunk tracker scanners from monitoring the system. All the newer Edacs systems are implementing this feature....San Antonio, State of Florida, Oklahoma city....... So even if you have a LPE200 or Jaguar and the software, if they run the ESK feature you will be screwed.

-RC-

USPSS · Post by **USPSS** » Sat Nov 01, 2003 6:04 pm

Riverside County Law is going to the ESK feature. Also LA County and LA City will be on the public service GE stuff. Honolulu is supposed to also.

2wayfreq · Post by **2wayfreq** » Sat Nov 01, 2003 10:35 pm

Double Doh!!!!

The criminals have ruined it for the rest of us I guess. Our dispatch kinda needs monitor and know when they are 97 on our casino property. We would do this with a scanner. Oh well..i guess theres always the phone

Twisted_Pear · Post by **Twisted_Pear** » Sun Nov 02, 2003 5:03 pm

EDACS ESK has since been cracked. Browse on over to TrunkedRadio.net's Forums to read more about it. It's not true encryption, just XORing the frames.

So it keeps an unauthorized radio off the network yet we can still "watch" and control a scanner to listen to what we want.

-Wayne

Radio_Cowboy · Post by **Radio_Cowboy** » Mon Nov 03, 2003 12:32 am

Cool Wayne....!

I went over there and checked that out......but you will still be screwed if the Edacs system is Pro-Voice, it sounds like....untill SOMEONE comes out with a computer controlled pro-voice scanner.

Glad Albuquerque ain't usein ESK....just regular pro-voice.

-RC-

ASTRO_25 · Post by **ASTRO_25** » Thu Nov 06, 2003 10:44 am

Radio_Cowboy wrote:Cool Wayne....!

I went over there and checked that out......but you will still be screwed if the Edacs system is Pro-Voice, it sounds like....untill SOMEONE comes out with a computer controlled pro-voice scanner.
-RC-

nah.. we've worked around that too.

You can monitor ProVoice conventionally by programming a ProVoice conventional personality with Inverted Polarity, and RX Network ID of 172. So, using the ESK version of etrunker, you control a regular radio then feed the 10.7 Mhz IF output from a good radio into a mixer, and then send it to the ProVoice radio which is monitoring conventionally. easy as pie.

ssybert · Post by **ssybert** » Thu Nov 06, 2003 11:36 am

I've got a couple BC785D's and one BC250D. While I think it's the greatest thing in the world to finally be able to monitor my local ops (which have been changing all over the state) again, I think the audio quality just plain sucks. It seems like when recieving P25 signals the audio has hit a max frequency response and flatens everything out above it. I think the quality is terrible and REAL REAL hard to make anything out of unless the enviroment is QUIET. How does the RS Pro-96 match up to this? I know when I recieve digital systems on an XTS the quality is astounding. If you've got a good signal into the XTS it's almost tough to tell the difference between analog and P25. When you recieve P25 on the 785D or 250D, you know it. Any possitive feedback about the quality on the pro-96 verse the 250D?

Also I read the Pro-96 DOES infact do 9600baud but does NOT do CQPSK? I dont think the 250D does CQPSK either, does it?

Scott.

2wayfreq · Post by **2wayfreq** » Fri Nov 07, 2003 2:09 pm

I just hope that these work arounds can be integrated into a future scanner. It would be kind-of a waste to set-up a LPE or Jaguar 700P just to monitor. Too $$$ anyway for the time being.

PRO-96---It's Great!

PRO-96---It's Great!

i can see it now

Pro-96 Scanner and what it will NOT do.

Pro-96 Scanner and what it will NOT do.

Pro-96 Scanner and what it will NOT do.

Pro-96 Scanner and what it will NOT do.

APCO Formats

This is puzzling to me