Federal Unitrol

jim · Post by **jim** » Fri Dec 12, 2003 4:24 pm

Anyone use a Federal Unitrol Touchmaster Delta siren?
Federal says to use this to repalce the discontinued PA400.
After installing it, I found that the siren only will work when the lights are on stage 3. It won't work any other time. A call to Federal verified this. They claim that they are going to redesign it to work like the PA400 or the Code 3 3892L6, but he says it probably won't happen. The 'hands free' doesn't even work from the horn button unless on stage 3.

This sucks! You can't use the siren unless you have the lights on all the way. What if you want to use the siren when on stage 1? You can't.

This evening's goal is to go inside and modify this unti to work like a normal system, such as the PA400 where the siren will work even without any lights at all on.

Wish me luck.

USPSS · Post by **USPSS** » Fri Dec 12, 2003 4:26 pm

Jim, there is a bypass switch on the top left that activates siren functions if the siren mode switch is in either wail or (hi-lo) I think. then the horn ring will work also. this is without liths on and not using the slide switch. if not let me know and I will PM you my phone #

jim · Post by **jim** » Fri Dec 12, 2003 4:35 pm

No bypass switch on these things. I was on the phone with Federal today and they verified that these only allow the "MODE" switch to operate on stage 3. You can use "test" mode, but you need to hold a button the entire time- you can't leave it run on its own. If you were on stage 1 or 2 and need the siren, you must manually hold the "TEST" switch for as long as you need the siren (useless during a chase or when on the radio) or hold the steering wheel horn button for as long as you need the siren.

USPSS · Post by **USPSS** » Fri Dec 12, 2003 4:40 pm

Sorry I missed the word DELTA in there, the regular touchmaster has the bypass and it does work.

nmfire10 · Post by **nmfire10** » Fri Dec 12, 2003 9:04 pm

Leave it to Federal. Do they actually like, maybe, try these things out before actually selling thousands of them?

jim · Post by **jim** » Sat Dec 13, 2003 7:56 am

Yes, I'm quite sure they DO test them.
And actually, as per conversation with a Federal rep yesterday, the sales are very low on these units and they ARE GETTING MANY REQUESTS AND COMPLAINTS ABOUT THIS EXACT PROBLEM FROM MANY PURCHASERS OF THIS PRODUCT. In fact, the rep that i spoke with (and some other engineers and Federal techs) have put in numerous requests to make this change and were told that it is being considered since the sales on this unit are lower than any other similar system on the market today.

Maybe I'm not the only one bitching about this according to Federal, them. They sell a unit which is totally different in operation from the 3892L6 and PA400- which are the most common controllers and the cops never like it because they need the siren to work at times when you are not in stage 3 lighting.

Yes- Federal tests them, as you state they probably do, BUT- Federal is not in a police car using them. They need customer and installer input in order to refine a product.

Chevrolet built the Citation and tested it, BUT it was a POS.
Testing a product means nothing about its function. Putting it in the field and seeing unhappy departments that want this new $430 dollar POS replaced two days later with a Code3 'cause the siren only works in stage 3 is great research for a company. If they get numerous complaints on a problem over and over, they will change it or be eaten for lunch. Federal IS building something that the departments are unhappy with once they get the unit.

The Unitrol IS a very well built system and has many options, but if you can't have the siren run unless you are on stage 3, what's the use?

I did spend about 3 hours inside of one last night and do now have it working as PA400 or 3892L6. You can use the siren at anytime you need with the mod done.
For anyone that does have one of these units and wants to do the mod, I'll post it. It's does require disassembly and modifications, so if you're not comfprtable doing PC board level work, I wouldn't recommend doing it.

tom IL · Post by **tom IL** » Sat Dec 13, 2003 3:47 pm

discontinued PA400??? It's still listed on Federal's website, when did they discontinue it?

FFParamedic571 · Post by **FFParamedic571** » Sat Dec 13, 2003 4:26 pm

The PA-400 has by far got to be the worst switching siren ever produced by Federal. The failure rate is 3-4 times that of the TM-4. Ive replaced almost 20 of them in the last 3 years. The problems run the gamut of.. Burnt out main power lead in on the board. No tones, the cheesy push on terminals. Who thought of the brilliant idea of using the same plugs as SMC controller for the funtions.

Ive had no problems with the TM-Delta's the departmens are used to using all their lights when going code 3. I wire mostly the Headlight flasher, corner strobes and bar intersection lights in position 3.

jedi_saber · Post by **jedi_saber** » Sat Dec 13, 2003 7:18 pm

Here's a question: Why would one prefer the touchmaster Delta over the regular TM-4? Is there a price or a features difference??
My cruiser has a UTM-4 and I absolutely love it, it is easy to wire, reconfigure, operate and such and never let me down...

On the delta siren, won't pressing and holding the "test" switch not activate the siren without the lights activated?

jim · Post by **jim** » Sat Dec 13, 2003 9:42 pm

yes, it will, but try to get into a 115 MPH pursuit while holding the TEST button.

Now try to get into a 115 MHP pursuit while holding the TEST button and calling the pursuit on the radio.

Bob · Post by **Bob** » Sat Dec 13, 2003 9:45 pm

If in a 115 MPH pursuit, why wouldn't you have the switch in stage 3?

Running a siren without lights at 115 just doesn't make sense to me.

nmfire10 · Post by **nmfire10** » Sat Dec 13, 2003 9:56 pm

Well, it depends on what you have on each position of the the slide switch. Not everyone uses it for rear / front / both, you know.

Post by Pj » Sun Dec 14, 2003 1:52 am

Nah----Front/Rear/All !

I just can't understand putting all the corner and/or remote strobes on one button, especally in fog prone areas. When its foggy, they complain about flashback and want the switch modified, but when its clear out "Don't touch the switch!"

I'll never figure these guys out.

The best setup that I have ran across:

Slide:
1 - Front bar + front corner strobes/flashers whatever
2 - Rear bar + rear as above
3 - All bar - all remote

Buttons
1 - Wig-wags
2 - Rear flashers
3 - Takedown
4 - Left Alley
5 - Right alley
6 - Hi-Lo, Cruise lights, gun lock, pattern selection

Tech225 · Post by **Tech225** » Sun Dec 14, 2003 8:57 am

Isn't that a carryover from the old Unitrol sirens from before Federal bought them out? I seem to remember a lot of complaining about this on the old 800 series.

Federal Unitrol

Federal Unitrol

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