Saber Alignment Best Person(s) Recomended...

chammerbeck · Post by **chammerbeck** » Wed Dec 14, 2005 8:13 am

Just looking for someone who is highly recomended by this group for aligning my UHF Saber I and maybe a few others later.... Would like
to see reliable/safe recomendations with rough pricing. I'm just afraid of being scammed.....

Thanks guys,
Chris

AEC · Post by **AEC** » Sat Dec 17, 2005 11:15 pm

Greetings!

What are you looking for in particular as far as servicing goes?

Normal alignments, or band splt changes?

Are all radios the same models types, same band split, or are they mixed, with regular Sabers and Systems Sabers included?

I've been performing Saber alignments and servicing since 1993, and I am pretty sure I can be of some assistance to you in this matter, please Email me or call me on the phone for any questions you may have.

I prefer to keep certain information off the list, this helps cutting down on subjects not germain to the list, and saves on bandwidth as well.

Thank you in advance!

chammerbeck · Post by **chammerbeck** » Sun Dec 18, 2005 6:46 am

Mine just seems to not have the output it should. It's a UHF Saber I. I'm also 99% sure my Freqs are all in-band. I do know there's an LCD behind the housing. I was possibly also looking to re-case this to a Saber III if possible. The others are VHF and one other UHF that needs to go out of band. Has the dreaded 403-433 split. I do have a ham license but our repeater does 440 and that's too far out for the VCO. I'm in no hurry at all to take care of the other radios, just the first one since it's my primary. Now if Motorola had a combo UHF and VHF radio..... I've been trying ham radios and they all suck. I also have a GP68 UHF that works well.

Thanks,
C

AEC · Post by **AEC** » Sun Dec 18, 2005 6:14 pm

Many times, the PA module has problems, but that's not the only cause for low output, it could be improperly set in the service menu, on high power, the power bias should be set to high as well, and set the softpot to UNDER 100, I use 73 as the highest level, otherwise, you get too much heat for NO return of benefits, plus the battery drains a lot faster as well.

As for changing band splits, you will need to swap a few modules first, the low split can't provide adequate 440 coverage, plus IF you could get it to operate on 440, the output impedance would kill the PA as it would not be seeing a 50 ohm resistive load due to the improper tolerances in the PA itself, the harmonic filter would be seeing a reactive load instead, too much inductance over resistive, again, not a good match.

Some Saber IIs are ONLY Saber IIs with either 48 or 72 channels max, there were many that were capable of 120, with the 8K front shield, those are common actually.

The 'crippled' Saber IIs can't do DTMF as they lack the membrane for the keys, and there are other features the crippled Saber IIs can't do either, and that's selective scan, manual telephone interconnect(MTI), and selectable MDC(pre/post/both), as well as QC-II and a few others I will not go into detail about.

If you can read and program a Saber II WITHOUT holding the three buttons down first, it's probably a Saber III in a II case, but not always.

Just a heads up for you.....

Have a wonderful christmas and new year!

Enterprize.....One to beam up!

MTS2000des · Post by **MTS2000des** » Sun Dec 18, 2005 6:23 pm

as far as who to work on your Saber, the old school techs are getting harder and harder to find (RIP Monty Sisco).

The Saber IE you have will take a lot of work to make into a Saber II/III 8K radio, almost cheaper to find one of the many fed split UHF Saber III's and module swap to get the Saber III. The display doesn't do anything, the Saber I memory board doesn't have the keypad flex, or associated COPE circuitry to support a keypad.

Saber PA's do fail and when they do, they do strange things. I've had a couple of VHF Sabers with bad PA's that have low output and also drained the battery within a few hours of just being on the radio (oscillation).

Sabers are superb analog portables IF you get one that has been properly tuned and aligned, they will outperform just about any analog radio made today and rival the charactersistics of the crystal radios of yesterday (ie, HT220, MX series, etc).

chammerbeck · Post by **chammerbeck** » Mon Dec 19, 2005 6:25 am

Thanks for the info guys. Hearing all of this just re-enforces my beliefs that the Sabers are some of the BEST radios out there. For this reason I wouldn't mind spending a little money on a "tune-up". I do have the necessary software and rib but no equipment for the alignment.

C

DJP126 · Post by **DJP126** » Mon Dec 19, 2005 10:15 pm

If you can read and program a Saber II WITHOUT holding the three buttons down first, it's probably a Saber III in a II case, but not always.

This has got to be my second favorite misconception of the Sabers. If you have to hold down the three buttons to read or program the radio, then it is an "A" version radio. That requirement was eliminated in the "C" series, which most of them are now (the "B" series is so rare, it's not worth mentioning. I only mention it now so as not to get questions like "Was there a "B" series?") Also, there are no Saber III's in a Saber II case. The model number designates a II or III. A "SAJ" or QXJ in the model # is a Saber II. Yes there might be a full keypad on the radio or it might have an 8K board or both, but it's still considered a II. The Saber III's have the "SAK" or "QXK" model #'s.

My favorite misconception is "Motorola pressurizes the submersible Sabers".javascript:emoticon(':lol:')
javascript:emoticon(':lol:')

AEC · Post by **AEC** » Tue Dec 20, 2005 2:48 am

From the manuals, the SAJ/SAN designates non secure radios, the QXK designates secure radios.

I have a factory Saber II that IS a Saber III in that all I had to swap was the keypad membrane and read the radio, which showed a full capable Saber III with the standard 5D CORE options, no holding down 3 buttons to get into program mode, just read, change, align and program...

The radio is the SAJ version, which is non secure.
I have scan, both mode slaved and selective, MTI as well as autodial, MPL, and selectable MDC(pre/post/both).
Full 120 channel 8K memory as well as the full keypad.

H44SAJ7139CN
FCC ID: AZ489FT4703
Serial: 655ALQxxxx

Scrolling the list shown on the display, as to what I currently have programmed into this radio reads as follows:
1. Zone
2. Key Mute/tones/No Tones
3. Lock/Unlocked/Locked
4. Sel PL/Reset(tone list)/PL Off
5. Scan/Sel Scan/Mode scan
6. Scanlist/Pri2, TX Mode...Etc......
7. PGM Scan/enter scan data(zone/Channel)

I removed MTI as I rarely use it on UHF, nor do I use QC-II for anything, so that was not programmed.

Serial numbers match radio data, and this was never an Ebay parts bin special, I owned it since new.

chammerbeck · Post by **chammerbeck** » Tue Dec 20, 2005 6:28 am

My "baby" is h44saj7139cnsp02

I just remember the lcd and three button contacts in the case.
No DTMF contacts or pads...

DJP126 · Post by **DJP126** » Tue Dec 20, 2005 7:26 pm

Sorry AEC, did mean to get you riled up but IF your Saber is model number H43SAJ7139CN, then it is a non-secure "C" series Saber II. Model number H43QXJ7139CN is the secure versin Saber II. The Saber III's have model #s of SAK or QXK. Yes you can have an 8K controller and a full keypad in a Saber II, but until the model # reads "SAK", it's a II.

AEC · Post by **AEC** » Tue Dec 20, 2005 9:08 pm

Dave:

Oh hell, it takes a lot more than this to ruffle the feathers, I'd rather see good info posted over idle rantings stacked on top to sift through.

I'm just happy there are people that take the time to post information usable to others, that's what makes this board so successful in the first place.

Have a wonderful Christmas EVERYBODY and a SAFE New Year as well!

*Egg Nog is NOT traditionally served up in shots, that's a clue to let you know there's no alcohol in it, so bartender, LINE 'EM UP!

Post by **wavetar** » Wed Dec 21, 2005 5:40 am

DJP126 wrote:Yes you can have an 8K controller and a full keypad in a Saber II, but until the model # reads "SAK", it's a II.

Pardon my ignorance, but what's the difference between an 8K/full keypad Saber II, and a legit Saber III? More channels/features?

Todd

billy7834 · Post by **billy7834** » Wed Dec 21, 2005 6:28 pm

Since we are on the topic....My S2 reads as follows under View Radio Information in the RSS.
CORE 8D
COPE 5C
DVP 3
CORE Patch ID 05
COPE Patch ID 01

Does that indicate that it has the 8k logic board?
If so, without changing the case, can I get the extra options in the display such as Scan/Sel Scan/Mode scan and
PGM Scan/enter scan data(zone/Channel) if I put in an S3 personality?
Can I get some functionality from these options with just the 3 button case?
Would I have to manually re-input all my channel and option info that I have in my S2 plug now?
Thanks. Bill

Edit to add more info: It has 120 channels and scans.

DJP126 · Post by **DJP126** » Wed Dec 21, 2005 8:21 pm

Although the above info is helpful, it doesn't tell you how much memory is in your controller board. The CORE is basically like a firmware version. Version 6D added RAT (Repeater Access Tone) capability. Once it is activated the two (normally) unused side buttons under the PTT can be programmed. 8D adds another feature that I don't remember at the moment & since I'm on vacation I probably won't be able to tell you until after Christmas when I get back to the depot to serve my final few days. After that, I get to join the other American Idols, oops, I mean Idles.

(Don't feel bad for me guys, I was planning on retiring this year anyway. Now I get to retire AND get a FULL YEARS PAY severance AND a years health benefit at the employee rate.)

billy7834 · Post by **billy7834** » Wed Dec 21, 2005 11:04 pm

I edited the above post to add that it has 120 channels and scans. I believe from what I've read here and on the main Batlabs site that indicates the 8k board...correct? So, while still keeping the S2 case with just the 3 buttons and display can I add any useful options, eg. the different display menu choices mentioned above?

tvsjr · Post by **tvsjr** » Wed Dec 21, 2005 11:19 pm

If it's got 120 channels + scan, it's an 8K board.

2Ks can be configured as:
48 channels, alpha tags, no scan
36 channels, no alpha, list-type scan (pick list 1 or 2 before entering scan... lists are not slaved to channels).

billy7834 · Post by **billy7834** » Thu Dec 22, 2005 4:50 am

Thanks...What about the possibility of enabling any useful S3 menu item while retaining the S2 case (see above)?

DJP126 · Post by **DJP126** » Thu Dec 22, 2005 7:30 am

You will have to create a new image using model number HnnSAK or HnnQXK to access the Saber III options. Some of those options require the full keypad. Unfortunately that requires programming all zones and channels from scratch. You won't be able to copy the info from the SII image.

billy7834 · Post by **billy7834** » Thu Dec 22, 2005 4:13 pm

Thanks.....Since I have about a hundred channels...I don't think it is a viable option. Plus it seems there is really nothing that can be gained without switching cases (to an S3).

Saber Alignment Best Person(s) Recomended...

Saber Alignment Best Person(s) Recomended...

Saber servicing.

Sabers...