GROUP,
HAS ANYONE HAD ANY LUCK RUNNING DOS BASED MOTOROLA SOFTWARE IN WINDOWS XP. I GET THE PROTOTYE ERROR MESSAGE WHEN TRYING TO READ A RADIO WILL IN THE THE DOS PROMPT MODE. THIS IS FOR THE MT AND HT SOFTWARE. ANY HELP WOULD BE APPRECIATED.
KYLE
RUNNING DOS BASED PROGRAMING SOFTWARE ON WINDOWS XP
Moderator: Queue Moderator
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ServerTech
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DOS vs. NT (XP)
Kyle,
If you're wanting to run a DOS program as complex as Motorola RSS on XP, Windows 2000 or NT, the short answer to that is, "No".
Now with the long answer!! With the introduction of XP was the beginning of the end of the 16 bit OS. That code has been passed down to all of the Microsoft OS's since DOS all the way up to Windows Me is finally withering on the vine. Although Win95, 98, and Me were 32 bit OS's, they were actually hybrid 32/16 bit OS's. They could natively run 32 bit programs, but they could almost as easily run 16 bit programs. Frankly, I'm surprised it worked! This was to make most programs backwards compatable because there are still a LOT of programs out there in the world running DOS or Windows 3.1 applications. Motorola RSS being one of those apps.
With NT, Win2000 and XP, a true 32 bit OS, running a 16 bit process is done through a 16 bit emulator in the OS itself. It only emulates the less complicated DOS-like programs. Only a limited number of 16 bit code will run properly on XP. That's not surprising considering the NT/2000 kernel operates so much differently than DOS.
My rule of thumb is simple: If it's a DOS program, run it on a DOS platform. If it's a 32 bit program, run it on NT/2000/XP.
Anyway, I hope I was able to help you out with an answer. It may not have been the answer you were hoping for, but at least now you have an idea on where to go from here.
Russ
If you're wanting to run a DOS program as complex as Motorola RSS on XP, Windows 2000 or NT, the short answer to that is, "No".
Now with the long answer!! With the introduction of XP was the beginning of the end of the 16 bit OS. That code has been passed down to all of the Microsoft OS's since DOS all the way up to Windows Me is finally withering on the vine. Although Win95, 98, and Me were 32 bit OS's, they were actually hybrid 32/16 bit OS's. They could natively run 32 bit programs, but they could almost as easily run 16 bit programs. Frankly, I'm surprised it worked! This was to make most programs backwards compatable because there are still a LOT of programs out there in the world running DOS or Windows 3.1 applications. Motorola RSS being one of those apps.
With NT, Win2000 and XP, a true 32 bit OS, running a 16 bit process is done through a 16 bit emulator in the OS itself. It only emulates the less complicated DOS-like programs. Only a limited number of 16 bit code will run properly on XP. That's not surprising considering the NT/2000 kernel operates so much differently than DOS.
My rule of thumb is simple: If it's a DOS program, run it on a DOS platform. If it's a 32 bit program, run it on NT/2000/XP.
Anyway, I hope I was able to help you out with an answer. It may not have been the answer you were hoping for, but at least now you have an idea on where to go from here.
Russ
I think the best solution is to create a separate partition on your XP machine and load DOS on it. Then you can use a partition manager to boot in "true" DOS when needed. Be aware that even in this scheme, many of the older Motorola RSS (like MT1000) will not work reliably on a processor faster than a 486. I expect your XP machine is faster than that! So, the really best solution is to use a separate 486 computer for these older programs.
John
John
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Heterodyne
- Batboard $upporter
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RADIO43
- Batboard $upporter
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- What radios do you own?: 900 MHZ APX4000
GROUP,
THANK YOU FOR YOUR RESPONSES. JUST TO LET YOU KNOW, MY SOFTWARE IS LISENCED AND I DO PROGRAM RADIO'S FOR A TOWNSHIP. THE ONLY REASON THAT I ASKED ABOUT THE XP DEAL IS BECAUSE THE DOS PROMPT IS THE ONLY TYPE TYPE OF DOS ON XP. SO YES I KNOW THAT YOU ARE NOT SUPPOSE TO RUN RSS ON DOS PROMPT AND I KNOW THAT YOU HAVE TO RUN SOME RSS ON THE FLAT DOS MODE WHEN YOU FIRST START UP YOUR COMPUTER. YOU ARE RIGHT I PROBABLY SHOULD HAVE DONE MY HOMEWORK ON THE SITE BEFORE ASKING THE QUESTION BUT I FIGURE I WOULD THROW IT OUT THERE. I GOT TWO GREAT ANSWERS FROM RADIOSERVER AND JOHN, I THANK THEM FOR THEIR TIME. AS FAR AS HETERODYNE, I WAS LOOKING FOR HELP AND I KNOW HOW HELPFUL THE PEOLE ON THE BOARD ARE, SO I APOLIGIZE TO YOU FOR WASTING YOUR TIME, IT WILL NOT HAPPEN AGAIN.
KYLE
THANK YOU FOR YOUR RESPONSES. JUST TO LET YOU KNOW, MY SOFTWARE IS LISENCED AND I DO PROGRAM RADIO'S FOR A TOWNSHIP. THE ONLY REASON THAT I ASKED ABOUT THE XP DEAL IS BECAUSE THE DOS PROMPT IS THE ONLY TYPE TYPE OF DOS ON XP. SO YES I KNOW THAT YOU ARE NOT SUPPOSE TO RUN RSS ON DOS PROMPT AND I KNOW THAT YOU HAVE TO RUN SOME RSS ON THE FLAT DOS MODE WHEN YOU FIRST START UP YOUR COMPUTER. YOU ARE RIGHT I PROBABLY SHOULD HAVE DONE MY HOMEWORK ON THE SITE BEFORE ASKING THE QUESTION BUT I FIGURE I WOULD THROW IT OUT THERE. I GOT TWO GREAT ANSWERS FROM RADIOSERVER AND JOHN, I THANK THEM FOR THEIR TIME. AS FAR AS HETERODYNE, I WAS LOOKING FOR HELP AND I KNOW HOW HELPFUL THE PEOLE ON THE BOARD ARE, SO I APOLIGIZE TO YOU FOR WASTING YOUR TIME, IT WILL NOT HAPPEN AGAIN.
KYLE
Wouldnt it be easier to just post the needed answers to a postees qestion rather than offending him?
And did it do any good to post a attack on another after he simply asked for help?
I have noticed a bit more of the not so professional replies and attitudes on the bd lately and would like to remind all that TOGETHER WE STAND/
DEVIDED WE FALL.
It is easier to just get along than to argue.
I have already started my list of names on this bd that i have seen cause problems rather than be of help on this bd and would advise others to do the same.
With enough of us doing this = the outcome just might improve the bd by ignoring those that seem to want to rile a postee up rather than just let the peace continue.
And now im adding my tenth name to the list.
And my appologies to the original postee for some of my fellow members replies.
EKLB
And did it do any good to post a attack on another after he simply asked for help?
I have noticed a bit more of the not so professional replies and attitudes on the bd lately and would like to remind all that TOGETHER WE STAND/
DEVIDED WE FALL.
It is easier to just get along than to argue.
I have already started my list of names on this bd that i have seen cause problems rather than be of help on this bd and would advise others to do the same.
With enough of us doing this = the outcome just might improve the bd by ignoring those that seem to want to rile a postee up rather than just let the peace continue.
And now im adding my tenth name to the list.
And my appologies to the original postee for some of my fellow members replies.
EKLB
There's two possible options:
1. You could create a dual-boot option and do it that way. We do that at work with our laptop that runs Win2K Pro. Motorola stuff works fine in that configuration.
2. You can push F8 while the machine is booting and select command prompt.
Either way works for us but YMMV.
Dan
1. You could create a dual-boot option and do it that way. We do that at work with our laptop that runs Win2K Pro. Motorola stuff works fine in that configuration.
2. You can push F8 while the machine is booting and select command prompt.
Either way works for us but YMMV.
Dan
1. Using the F8 command during XP startup is not the same as running native DOS, and it is likely to cause problems. In addition to the 16 bit/32 bit issue, the F8 command does not get you to native DOS, but only a form of DOS emulation, and this emulation does not permit direct application access to the hardware, which the older RSSs insist upon. Doing it this way can cause lost bits in the serial communication, and that can corrupt a radio. The advice to have a separate machine, preferably 486, running native MS-DOS 6.22 (or PC-DOS 7.0) is sound advice.
2. For what it is worth, I second the sentiments of ELKB.
2. For what it is worth, I second the sentiments of ELKB.
I also agree.
IF you don't have something to say that's either positive, or helpful, don't. I'd rather have someone come here, ask a question, and get an answer without attitude or other people putting comments in that aren't helpful.
I'll be keeping my eye on this, and moderating where necessary.
This isn't something I enjoy doing. I shouldn't have to moderate anything, but this is the SECOND post that I’ve had to moderate with respect to this issue.
If you have questions, comments, complaints, you can feel free to direct them to my PM box.
-Alex
(Didn't another user just recently get the boot for something like this (on a much larger level...)? Think about it.)
IF you don't have something to say that's either positive, or helpful, don't. I'd rather have someone come here, ask a question, and get an answer without attitude or other people putting comments in that aren't helpful.
I'll be keeping my eye on this, and moderating where necessary.
This isn't something I enjoy doing. I shouldn't have to moderate anything, but this is the SECOND post that I’ve had to moderate with respect to this issue.
If you have questions, comments, complaints, you can feel free to direct them to my PM box.
-Alex
(Didn't another user just recently get the boot for something like this (on a much larger level...)? Think about it.)
I found when I started programming on a XP based pc I could not use the boot disk created with XP. The pc booted to the a:/ but i could not change to the c:/ to load the rss. I got XP Professional and installed it on my laptop, made a boot disk and everything worked great. I didn't have to partition my drive or load a version of dos.
T.J.P. FF/EMT
One possible problem with booting from a Boot Disk (floppy) and then accessing the hard drive (C:) is the type of formating used on the hard drive. Under XP (and WinNT & Win2K) you can format your hard drive in NTFS. If you do, you will not be able to access that drive when booting from a floppy. There are ways around this but they can be complex.
This could be the reason TK173 had a problem. When reinstalling WinXP (Professional or Home) you have an option to format your drive as NTFS or FAT(32). So, I suspect when he reinstalled and "everything worked" it was because the new install didn't use NTFS.
Still, any version of WinXP will have the same problems with running an older Motorola RSS program. You really need DOS (and preferrably a 486) and not a DOS window in XP.
John
This could be the reason TK173 had a problem. When reinstalling WinXP (Professional or Home) you have an option to format your drive as NTFS or FAT(32). So, I suspect when he reinstalled and "everything worked" it was because the new install didn't use NTFS.
Still, any version of WinXP will have the same problems with running an older Motorola RSS program. You really need DOS (and preferrably a 486) and not a DOS window in XP.
John
Another Tactic to try
One thing I've tried with success is a variation on the 2nd computer scheme. I picked up an HP100LX handheld computer off ebay with a serial cable that will interface with my rib( got a good deal - only $30.00) I've been using this little jewel to program all of my older (dos based RSS ) rigs and it works like a champ. It's powered by AA cells and while the screen is small you can work with it OK (until your arms get too short 
There are a lot of these older DOS based handhelds to be found out there that would at least help with your problem AND several offer PCMCIA card compatability so you don't have to worry about carrying floppies or CDs just load what you need on a card and plug it in.
Also,
As an alternative to booting from a floppy have you thought of making a bootable CD that has the RSS and DOS files you need on it?
might be worth a shot. You'd still probably need to save archive files on a floppy but it might be worth a shot.
There are a lot of these older DOS based handhelds to be found out there that would at least help with your problem AND several offer PCMCIA card compatability so you don't have to worry about carrying floppies or CDs just load what you need on a card and plug it in.Also,
As an alternative to booting from a floppy have you thought of making a bootable CD that has the RSS and DOS files you need on it?
might be worth a shot. You'd still probably need to save archive files on a floppy but it might be worth a shot.
Ray Smith
KE4OGG
Corinth-Shiloh Fire Station 3/Oakway Rescue ER-3
KE4OGG
Corinth-Shiloh Fire Station 3/Oakway Rescue ER-3
HI:
1. Do not let the Unrest in the world become part
of your posts. It even happens to me.
2. When dealing with Motorola Radios ( Old & New Alike )
you would be well advised to have a [ Dedicated ] Program
Computer.
I know it sounds like a hassle, but Computers are senstive,
and its NOT wise to have to much loaded onto your Programming
Computer.
Just ( 1 ) dumb mistake can take a healthly radio, and turn
it into a Brick
Motorola does not have Games, Business SW, or anything else
loaded on their Factory Computers !!
Most cases for the Earlier Series, a good 386-486-25 with 4Mb
of Ram is still used even today.
Later Model RSS ( CDM/Pro Series etc ) is used on Win98SE2 and
in most cases is a Stand Alone Computer.
Good Back up Power Supplies for Both the Rib Box and Computer
are Highly Recommended. Defrag / Scan Disc often ! Will insure a
safe program session.
Monty
1. Do not let the Unrest in the world become part
of your posts. It even happens to me.
2. When dealing with Motorola Radios ( Old & New Alike )
you would be well advised to have a [ Dedicated ] Program
Computer.
I know it sounds like a hassle, but Computers are senstive,
and its NOT wise to have to much loaded onto your Programming
Computer.
Just ( 1 ) dumb mistake can take a healthly radio, and turn
it into a Brick
Motorola does not have Games, Business SW, or anything else
loaded on their Factory Computers !!
Most cases for the Earlier Series, a good 386-486-25 with 4Mb
of Ram is still used even today.
Later Model RSS ( CDM/Pro Series etc ) is used on Win98SE2 and
in most cases is a Stand Alone Computer.
Good Back up Power Supplies for Both the Rib Box and Computer
are Highly Recommended. Defrag / Scan Disc often ! Will insure a
safe program session.
Monty
Re: Another Tactic to try
That could very well work. That's the main problem with RSS such as MTSX/MCS/Astro which takes up more than a single floppy disk. Using a boot floppy disk doesn't help you in an NTFS environment, since you can't get to the hard drive to run the installed RSS. However, once installed on the hard-drive, copying the directories onto a DOS-bootable CD would allow you to run them on NTFS machines.RSmithER3 wrote:
Also,
As an alternative to booting from a floppy have you thought of making a bootable CD that has the RSS and DOS files you need on it?
might be worth a shot. You'd still probably need to save archive files on a floppy but it might be worth a shot.
Todd
That's what I did for over a year (bootable CD with RSS files on it) until I got a P1-75 laptop. Now I use the laptop as a dedicated programming computer.
If I have some hefty codeplug editing that I want to do, I boot the laptop to Win 98 SE and let it log onto my network, run RSS on my faster machine, automatically map the laptop drive to my PC, run the rss and make the changes (I hate typing on a little keyboard, me and my ogre self) and save.
If I have some hefty codeplug editing that I want to do, I boot the laptop to Win 98 SE and let it log onto my network, run RSS on my faster machine, automatically map the laptop drive to my PC, run the rss and make the changes (I hate typing on a little keyboard, me and my ogre self) and save.
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Heterodyne
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- Joined: Thu Jul 25, 2002 11:54 pm
I just wanted to apologize for my message to Kyle and the rest of the thread.
I had had a bad night and ended up taking it out on Kyle, and for that I want to offer my sincere and undying apologies to Kyle, batlabs and the moderators.
Sorry guys - its my bad and I'll try my best to make sure the various pissings in my life are kept away from my supposed distractions (grin)
Again, Sorry Kyle... I hope you can accept my apology.. I feel terrible about it, and I hope everyone I offended accepts it too. I'm a big enough person to accept when I farked up, and I did so big time.
Sorry guys.. I hope we can put this behind us.
(Although I do think that comparing me to astro_saber is hitting below the belt! (hehehe))
- bryan
I had had a bad night and ended up taking it out on Kyle, and for that I want to offer my sincere and undying apologies to Kyle, batlabs and the moderators.
Sorry guys - its my bad and I'll try my best to make sure the various pissings in my life are kept away from my supposed distractions (grin)
Again, Sorry Kyle... I hope you can accept my apology.. I feel terrible about it, and I hope everyone I offended accepts it too. I'm a big enough person to accept when I farked up, and I did so big time.
Sorry guys.. I hope we can put this behind us.
(Although I do think that comparing me to astro_saber is hitting below the belt! (hehehe))
- bryan
I didn't see what you said but I suppose I could forgive you... as long as keep your pissing where it belongs. Why it would be anywhere but the bathroom or a tree, I don't knowHeterodyne wrote: Sorry guys - its my bad and I'll try my best to make sure the various pissings in my life are kept away from my supposed distractions (grin)
(Although I do think that comparing me to astro_saber is hitting below the belt! (hehehe))
The astrosaber one was pretty harsh. lol
Anyway, back on subject....
For our FD radios (Kenwoods, but same deal), I have an old HP 166Mhz computer with 32mb of ram. The thing has Win2K on it which is like towing a Yachy with a Honda Civic. I don't use it. I boot with a floppy and have another floppy with the RSS Software on it. Works great so far. Haven't tried with /\/\ yet.
"I'll eat you like a plate of bacon and eggs in the morning. "
- Some loser on rr.com
eBay at it's finest:
Me: "What exactly is a 900Mhz UHF CB?"
Them: "A very nice CB at 900Mhz speed!"
- Some loser on rr.com
eBay at it's finest:
Me: "What exactly is a 900Mhz UHF CB?"
Them: "A very nice CB at 900Mhz speed!"