Batboard

I am trying to find a copy of a LAPD codeplug for a XTS3000 Model III. Any help is appreciated

Unless there bought some, there isn't any offical "LAPD Style" codeplugs for LAPD. The old MODAT style codeplug was for the Astro Saber, and rendared an IMBE radio back to VSLEP. The newer codeplug got rid of software encyption and MODAT and added IMBE and something else.

If you want to monitor LAPD, all you need is an IMBE radio, and change the digital squelch to Digital CSQ. Other than that, there really isn't anything special about the codeplug. The other features that it has is OTAR/OTACS etc, which for 99% of the people in the world don't need. The codeplugs (even the old one that is no longer used) is considered RESTRICTED by Motorola. If you send in a radio to be repaired, you better have documentation that you bought your radio that way, or they will send it back with a basic flashcode.

I'm just curious... why is Motorola so anal about LAPD codeplugs?

Apparantly because Motorola 'developed' it for the LAPD, and the contract probably stipulates only the LAPD can have this certain feature set.

Bugs

But what if some other system decided to go Astro and wanted the same feature set? Sounds like a scam to me....

Guess they would have to talk to the LAPD and/or Motorola and see if they could come to an arrangement.

Bugs

I am sorry for any confusion...........

I only need to know what the frequencies are for the new digital system.

They are the same as the old, just now in digital.
Check out http://www.freqofnature.com/lapd.htm

well for one thing you wont find a codeplug for that particular radio. LAPD does not use XTS radios only Astros at this time. Culver City and Monterey Park do use XTS radios that I know of.....

Does anyone know how the program their radios?
Do they split it into zones or certain modes for the rotary switch and the remainder are through the chan button? or ???

Does anyone out there monitor them an a regular basis>?

If so, any comments, etc on the allocation of channels, system operation in general, sound of transmissions, etc???

This could be an interesting topic////

Its not possible to scan all the lapd stuff if your listening with an astro xts radio at one time... you can only scan 16 channels at a time .... as for zones it depends on how you program the radio...

I put all the dispatch stuff in one zone, tac channels in 1 or 2 zones and another zone for misc stuff....I use the knobs to move between zones but u can also prgram it to switch channels in the same zone... If you want to scan all their channels... the astro OR xts wont do it at one time

Uniden is coming out with a digital scanner in November (pending) - this might be the better route if u want to scann all the lapd dig stuff at one time.....then again if you have a need for gmrs , ham radio, business applications.... these radios sure can do more than one thing.....the scanner will be much cheaper than o buy a motorola digital radio just for listening

Digital sound like "robots" and No I do not listen to LAPD on a regular basis -more like on occasion...I dont have the time to be listning often....

Just some intel I heard, LAPD and most of the agencies in LA County will be going to full time encryption since they are on digital anyway, so By By to all the listeners, I think the Uniden scanner made that happen.

and to think digital scanner listeners would be able to listen to LAPD or other agencies on digital......if i'm not mistaken wont going to encryption lessen range or is it an insignificant amount or distance?

one thing for sure is the expense to go encryption ... ummmm why didnt LAPD have ALL their radios with encryption boards? for years LAPD stayed in the "clear" - why the sudden anti scanner listener mentality? Im sure they could have gone encrypted years before....is the cost realy necessary... makes you wonder where tax payer money is going these days...

other agencies now on digital are monterey park, alhambra, el monte - are these or will be affected of the "anti scanner" mentality?

Once in digital mode, encryption does nothing to range or claity of signal, Digital is Digital, only the way it is digitized is changed, not so for the old encryption methods like DES and DVP which was digitized over an anaolge signal and it did cause problems if it was not adjusted properly.

I think the mentality is that they really need to have secure conversations and not have everyone knowing what is going on, especially in these days.

Most of the agencies in the LA area will be going that route soon, rumor also has it that LA Sheriff will be doing something new in the near future so it looks like the scanner thing will be a thing of the past.

Orange County LAW Enforcement is already that way.

Well, now you can use the excuse for security in this day in age. However, I don't think that all the liberal lawyers and thinkers in California will allow it to happen anyways. They will cite all sorts of FOI laws etc.

On another perspective, I don't know if I would want to know that my encyption key was lost for some time while trying to transmit in an emergency situation. I know that LAPD may have the OTAR option, but in a fast paced enviroment like LA, is that a chance that you want to take before the radio is rekeyed or you try to send a request while running after someone?

Also, at $650 a pop for a -OFB board, time x amount of radios, that can be expensive (without a volume discount).

As a side note, the Connecticut State Police headed of a similar court battle by letting the media tap into the radio system as long as they paid for all costs incurred, and they didn't devulge any information. CSP does not use encryption (but is IMBE), except for a couple of small units and its simplex. Last time I talked to a service tech for them, none of their towers had the securenet hardware.

Well, unless they have a fool proof plan for regular re-keying, the key WILL leak out somehow, I see or rather hear about that all over the place....

One the question, does anyone know how the OTAR is done?

For specualtion purposes, let's say I live in LA, (i don;t)
and I wanted to have my radio follow every other radio in LA when re-keyed, how would or would not that occur?

I dont know a thing about re-keying OTA...

ANyone???

Bueller????? Bueller????????

LOL

I know everything there is to know about OTAR, and then some. OTAR is not fool proof and neither is KVL keyloading, but then again, what is. There are many ways to beat the system and get keys. You'll be surprised. But practically nobody knows how and if this guy called nobody doesn't talk, then nobody will know. That is a good thing, right?

Since you want to know how to get rekeyed, I'll tell you, but I won't go into details. This will probably only confuse most of you further. If using MDC OTAR, you need to have the unique shadow key for the radio you're impersonating. By impersonating, I mean you need to have the MDC Id programmed in your codeplug and have the matching shadow key. If OTAR is being performated using group OTAR, then you need the common shadow key. These are closely guarded secrets....I would hope so.

If using APCO OTAR, it's similar, but you need to have the appropriate Key Encryption Keys loaded and have the Astro Ids programmed.

Even if you manage to accomplish this, watch out. When radios start getting rekeyed, there will be duplicate (or more) acks for the rekeys. An alert operator can catch this in their real-time displays or logs. Then they will start wondering. Ususlly Keys/CSKs/USKs (MDC OTAR) and TEKs/KEKs (APCO OTAR) are distributed over the air. If an agency wants to be protective of their keys, every so often they would manually rekey each radio with new shadow keys and KEKs. A sloppy agency will hand out the same USK to each radio and never modify them.

I hope this helps and at the same time hinders.

I would be very carefull about trying to get a key for a major LE organization, if you get caught it is a federal offense and you will go to jail. I know a lot of the guys out here at the administration levels and they will prosecute, they will also be polling radios and if somethine comes up funny then there will be changes. I think the officers on the street will take a VERY dim view of anyone that can hear them after the changes are made, I would think that your radio will be taken and you will get 3 hots and a cot for a while.

USPSS wrote:Just some intel I heard, LAPD and most of the agencies in LA County will be going to full time encryption since they are on digital anyway, so By By to all the listeners, I think the Uniden scanner made that happen.

I've heard the opposite regarding LAPD normal comms. Guess we'll see!

Shaun,

I never infered clear comm was a problem or that I feel that is wrong, but when they are encrypted then that is another story, getting a key a using it unless you are authorized is a violation of the law.

As long as the agency is in the clear GO FOR IT, but if you illegally get a key and listen to encryption then by by.

Just FYI, LAPD does have SOME XTS3000's. I've seen a few of them downtown (detectives in and around CCB) but none in patrol that I've seen. I don't think they have many though.