Motorola Saber: CORE Checksum Error & Dead Radio

[kc8mln2]

I have a Motorola Saber I Secure, UHF 440-470Mhz, Model H44QXN7139CN, Core Ver: 5D, Core Patch 08... The radio was working then reprogrammed it and then it was dead, no TX, RX or CSQ when you push the Mon button. I tried to read and got this message.. "Checksum Error in CORE personality data..." I opened a good codeplug and reprogrammed multiple times and even tried using different good codeplugs and no luck. I changed from programming with the RPF stored in the radio and the original values, and still no change. I then used the RSS (ver R07.01.00) to "create" a "new" codeplug using the same model number and still no luck.

***UPDATE***

This issue has been fixed... I recovered this radio and this issue is CLOSED for me, thanks to all who provided input..

[HLA]

open the radio and check the ribbon cables. since the monitor button don't work and give you csq it's a hardware problem.

[N9LLO]

Sounds like your computer bricked it. Lots of computers will read Sabers but many will blow the radio when used to write the radio. What computer are you using? You may need to build a new codeplug and try an old 386 computer to write it.

Chris

[phrawg]

Good advice, and also please turn caps and bold off. Type normally.
that is considered screaming in internet forums. Thanks, Phrawg

[AEC]

Greetings:

From the 'sound' of it, you have loose modules in the radio, or loose ribbon flex cables included, check the retaining screws on the synthesizer module, and the rcvr. IF module and make certain those are tightened firmly to the main board by the back cover, the book recommends 6 in. Lbs. of torque so do not overtighten or the module threads will strip and you'll have to get a replacement.

One other inspection you can make is to carefully remove the modules and look for bent pins, the pins are fragile and can't take any bending with out snapping off.

Do the modules seat firmly, or do they simply drop in without effort, if they do, try the old MT-500 trick of gently squeezing the sockets with a needle-nosed pliers, but do it GENTLY, do NOT oversqueeze or you'll ruin the sockets forever.

I know you saved the codeplug, and if you get the radio to function even a little bit, reprogram it using F6(radio's current tuning data) and see what takes place once that is done.

If the controller didn't take a dump, you should be able to restore operation back to what it was before the problem.

You could inspect the controller board for shorts of any kind also, use air to remove debris if there is any, same goes with corrosion, if that gets into the base pins on the frame, it can also cause 'dead radio' issues.

Do all the pins on the frame base look clean and in alignment, and the proper height?
You can usually lift them up a little to restore proper contact if some are seating closer to the frame, that can also cause the problem you are having since the accessory connector is routed through the base of the radio's case to the chassis.

[oh2glg]

Sounds like your computer bricked it. Lots of computers will read Sabers but many will blow the radio when used to write the radio. What computer are you using? You may need to build a new codeplug and try an old 386 computer to write it.

Chris

The problem that was described at top sounds like what I have, except in my case it's a Saber II.

If the problem is the computer, how can one resolve it? What is the reason it happens? Bad hardware on COM-port?

[kc8mln2]

I thow that the problem is NOT anything inside the radio,..ie ribbon cables, loose parts...the problem was caused from writing to the radio and again, the problem is not the computer, as I have used it for 2 years for other sabers and other models of motorola radios. I have programmed other sabers with it after this one crashed without any problem. I just need to know how to restore this radio. I already tried to create a new codeplug and that didnt work, also tried to put the original codeplug back into it and that didnt work either...so, if the CORE did take a "dump" and "crash" how can I restore the radio to use it again? or does it need to go to a radio shop or the depot for the lab rss to restore it? oh, and sorry for the original bold in the post, i'm new here to the boards, but have been on batlabs for a long time...thanks, Tom Gary - KC8MLN [email protected]

[AEC]

Since all else is good to go, when did you last change the battery on the RIB?
Once they start to die, you can't program the radio anymore, read just fine though(for the most part).

Since all was okay during the read cycle, and you have done the same thing to other Sabers, I'd check that battery, that's an often overlooked item, but a top order item if you want to use your radio.

[phrawg]

Ok, Here's what you need to try. This will sound scary but I have done
it many times. Set up to program the radio and make sure all cables
are tight and battery is good in the rib and radio etc. NOW,
here is the scary part. Start loading the correct code plug for the radio.
Watch the rss screen carefully and when the core is about half loaded,
TURN THE RADIO OFF. Leave it off till the rss faults and times out
by itself. Now turn the radio on and it will of course display errors.
Try and reload the codeplug this time letting it go through the complete
cycle. What this does is purposely corrupt the radio to a point where
when the rss starts to load to the radio it flags it as a replaced virgin
controler and allows all of the code plug from the computer to
overwrite the radio COMPLETELY. I have saved many a saber
that way and if it does not work then usually it is more than just
corrupted firmware but rather a complete eprom or processor failure.
Of course after you do this you will need to do a complete re-alignment
of all of the softpot settings to get your performance back, but it
is always better than a "bricked" radio that makes
a very pretty paperweight. Hope this may help. Phrawg

[mickey]

CAN ANYONE HELP ME W/BAD the COPE or CORE data got corrupted
I CAN'T REPROGAM RADIO AT ALL ON SABER

SABER-3-H44SAK
SABER-2-H44SAJ

[Pj]

[kc8mln2]

You will have to create a new radio personality from scratch using the creat new radio data file, you input the model number into the RSS to do this...

[AEC]

With a checksum error, and being a model I, there is no display indicator of the level or severity of the fault or faults.

If the checksum error is always persistent no matter what is done, then I would swap out the synthesizer and try a coedplug rewrite.

Basic operation of the radio is derived from the synthesizer, and there may be a problem within that module.

I've had a few die on me and no matter what i tried, I could not get the radio to power up and take a codeplug.

Also check the reference oscillator and see if it's working, as you can take a freq. counter and attach a 'sniffer' probe to look for signal generation that will cause the counter to register, and if the signal is strong enough, you should get a pretty good lock to read the frequency.

If it's off a little is of no concern as you are only searching for Xtal operation.

My thoughts rest with the synthesizer.

The other trick is to do a component swap and replace until you isolate the defective part or module/s.

The reason I suspect the sythnesizer is due to the fact it is retained by the rear cover screws, and if those were replaced with longer screws than should be there, they will cut into the board inside the case and cut traces which affects transmit and receive(I've decased several caused by this).

The 'nuts' that the cover screws into on the synthesizer are straight through and do not have set depths, so it is possible to tighten the rear cover to a point that the two screws cut into the board.

It's probably one of two designs, with the stamped steel cover that's spot welded, or the diecast design that has a cover that is retained by a single phillips screw, but both can be ruined in the same manner I described above.

If you have a 403-433 split module, try it and see if you can read the radio, then you will know for sure.

[kc8mln2]

I'd still try to create a new codeplug with the model number for your unit....

[dallas]

Ok, Here's what you need to try. This will sound scary but I have done
it many times. Set up to program the radio and make sure all cables
are tight and battery is good in the rib and radio etc. NOW,
here is the scary part. Start loading the correct code plug for the radio.
Watch the rss screen carefully and when the core is about half loaded,
TURN THE RADIO OFF. Leave it off till the rss faults and times out
by itself. Now turn the radio on and it will of course display errors.
Try and reload the codeplug this time letting it go through the complete
cycle. What this does is purposely corrupt the radio to a point where
when the rss starts to load to the radio it flags it as a replaced virgin
controler and allows all of the code plug from the computer to
overwrite the radio COMPLETELY. I have saved many a saber
that way and if it does not work then usually it is more than just
corrupted firmware but rather a complete eprom or processor failure.
Of course after you do this you will need to do a complete re-alignment
of all of the softpot settings to get your performance back, but it
is always better than a "bricked" radio that makes
a very pretty paperweight. Hope this may help. Phrawg

Very old message from 2005 saves my Saber. Thank you a lot, Phrawg!
I know that battery is low but still decided to program
Very good lesson... again and again.. CORE checksum error.
I predicted such final -- was lazy to charge battery -- so it happened at about 99%, really.

Thanks

[RA1AIE]

I was try to program Motorola Saber II Securenet (H43QXJ7139CN, 146-162 MHz version) from PC with Core 2 Duo processor using Saber RSS R07.01.00 under DOS boot CD. Radio was read correctly, then I added several channels and write radio. After that, radio display "ERR 0 C1". When I try to read radio, RSS displays CRS errors in CORE, Internal and External COPE. I try to recovery radio as written phrawg: turn off radio when the core is about half loaded and then program it again, but after that radio dispay error "ERR 0 81" and don't work.

What else i can made? Does old computer (386 etc.) required to recovery radio?

P.S. Sorry for my bad English.

[GlennD]

When I was dragged into the screen room a Pentium 100Mhz was used tor old radio programming. I noticed it would not fully program Sabers. It would not transfer tuning values.

I found an oold DEC 486 50Mhz in the junk pile that I now use. It programs Sabers perfectly.

A Saber is one of the few radios that can always be recovered. We used a custom version of 6.28 and 7.01. The 6.28 was SP and had expanded band limits.

YOU MUST USE A VERY SLOW COMPUTER!

[Andreas]

A PC up to PIII-800 with disabled cache should always work fine.

Andreas

[RA1AIE]

You mean the memoty cache?

[Andreas]

Processor cache!
You can disable it in the bios,or use a little DOS program to do it.
You can find it on my homepage (downloadpage).

Andreas

[mr.syntrx]

A PC up to PIII-800 with disabled cache should always wor fine.

Andreas

Except for the "AUSSP" (Australian) Saber RSS, which is based on a really, really ancient version of the standard Saber RSS. In this case it really does need to be 386 or below.

[Andreas]

Really not?
I never had any problems.Even the very old MC-Micro and GP300Lab (normally makes a runtime error on pc´s,faster than a 386),run and program the radios fine and no problems with the earlier,custom made MX1000 (european Saber) RSS!

Andreas

[RA1AIE]

Problem was in self-made programming board. I try to use original RIB with Pentium I notebook, and my saber had been programed correctly.