It is a little to fast for the Visar and the MX3000 radio's, is there a way to make the computer a bit slower?
I think it is an 486...
Thanks,
GJ
IBM 755C to fast for programming Visar.
Moderator: Queue Moderator
Still too fast on a 486? Do you happen to know the processor speed? I've seen 486s running at 100MHz, and Pentiums running at 75MHz. The funny thing is, the Pentiums seem much more stable & RSS friendly than the 486s at higher processor speeds, but the 486s are definitely better at lower speeds.
Ae you running any type of Windows, or is this a DOS only computer? There are some tricks to try if it does have Win9X on it. Try checking in your BIOS as well and disabling any type of CPU cache if you can.
There is a program called Moslo which can lower your processor speed by inserting interrupt routines, but most people haven't found it to be very helpful, and it may even screw your radio. Post back with any extra info or results.
Todd
Ae you running any type of Windows, or is this a DOS only computer? There are some tricks to try if it does have Win9X on it. Try checking in your BIOS as well and disabling any type of CPU cache if you can.
There is a program called Moslo which can lower your processor speed by inserting interrupt routines, but most people haven't found it to be very helpful, and it may even screw your radio. Post back with any extra info or results.
Todd
GJ-
You can probably find the systems specs under StartSettings|Control PanelSystemGeneral tab
I would not even think of trying to program an older radio under Windows, or in a DOS window. You will likely end up with a paperweight (and the Visars aren't really much good at that either).
At the least, restart your computer in MS-DOS mode and run the program from the command line prompt. Better yet, create a disk patition and install a real DOS install.
If you don't have a lot of experience in system set-up, or in DOS, find some one to help you through in person.
Better safe than sorry.......
Good luck, be careful!
You can probably find the systems specs under StartSettings|Control PanelSystemGeneral tab
I would not even think of trying to program an older radio under Windows, or in a DOS window. You will likely end up with a paperweight (and the Visars aren't really much good at that either).
At the least, restart your computer in MS-DOS mode and run the program from the command line prompt. Better yet, create a disk patition and install a real DOS install.
If you don't have a lot of experience in system set-up, or in DOS, find some one to help you through in person.
Better safe than sorry.......
Good luck, be careful!
-
PCSAR4x4652
- Posts: 25
- Joined: Sat Dec 01, 2001 4:00 pm
- What radios do you own?: MTS2000, Spectra & VRS/PA
It may be easer to make a DOS 6.22 boot disk and boot the computer into DOS 6.22 from the floppy disk and run the RSS.
The Visar/HT1000 RSS has a timing isue with the way Windows 9x handles the serial port timing, as does some of the other RSS packages. Booting into a real, I MEAN A REAL DOS is the only way to prevent the doorstop syndrom or a "corrupt code plug" in your radio. Using a real DOS has eliminated 90 percent of our problems here in our shop. And we have been using RSS since 1986. Some of our computers are dual boot Win 9x and DOS 6.22 and one 200mmx pentium is set-up with a triple boot, Win NT, Win 9x and DOS 6.22. It even runs Windows for Workgroups, as this one is.
The Visar/HT1000 RSS has a timing isue with the way Windows 9x handles the serial port timing, as does some of the other RSS packages. Booting into a real, I MEAN A REAL DOS is the only way to prevent the doorstop syndrom or a "corrupt code plug" in your radio. Using a real DOS has eliminated 90 percent of our problems here in our shop. And we have been using RSS since 1986. Some of our computers are dual boot Win 9x and DOS 6.22 and one 200mmx pentium is set-up with a triple boot, Win NT, Win 9x and DOS 6.22. It even runs Windows for Workgroups, as this one is.
Yes, with Win95/98 the "reboot in MS-DOS Mode" from the shut down menu is NOT a good DOS emulation. Unless you have a separate partition loaded with the FULL DOS 6.22, all we are dealing with are DOS EMULATIONS. Even a DOS 6.22 boot disk is just an emulation of true DOS, giving your computer the bare essentials to function. Remember, true DOS 6.22 is comprised of 3 compressed floppies.
Most people are not familiar with partitioning a hard drive, so here's two options:
A boot disk should work for you, to create one in WIN95, go to "Control Panel", then "Add/Remove Programs". There should be a tab labeled "startup disk". Go to that, click on "create disk" & follow the instructions on creating a boot disk. You can then boot your computer using that disk into a better DOS emulation.
The second option is to find a computer loaded with Win98, and locate the shortcut under "C:windows" labeled "MS-DOS Mode for Games with EMS & XMS Support". Copy this shortcut onto a disk & transfer it to your Win95 computer, just copy it to the desktop, for convenience. Double-clicking on this will reboot your computer into an even better DOS emulation. Type "exit" at the "C" prompt to boot back into Windows.
This one I've seen work time & again even when a boot disk doesn't, because it does a much better job of allocating extended or expanded memory in DOS, something a regular boot disk doesn't handle very well. You may even notice the RSS running a bit slower in this mode than with a boot disk or by rebooting through the shut down menu. I beleive this is why it seems to be more RSS friendly than other methods.
Please note I'm NOT telling anyone to run the RSS through a DOS window. I've been somewhat flamed in the past for that because I don't think some people realize this method is just as legit as a boot disk, both do the same thing, one just uses a floppy, the other points the computer to a different set of boot files upon start up. DOS EMULATIONS, both.
Todd
Most people are not familiar with partitioning a hard drive, so here's two options:
A boot disk should work for you, to create one in WIN95, go to "Control Panel", then "Add/Remove Programs". There should be a tab labeled "startup disk". Go to that, click on "create disk" & follow the instructions on creating a boot disk. You can then boot your computer using that disk into a better DOS emulation.
The second option is to find a computer loaded with Win98, and locate the shortcut under "C:windows" labeled "MS-DOS Mode for Games with EMS & XMS Support". Copy this shortcut onto a disk & transfer it to your Win95 computer, just copy it to the desktop, for convenience. Double-clicking on this will reboot your computer into an even better DOS emulation. Type "exit" at the "C" prompt to boot back into Windows.
This one I've seen work time & again even when a boot disk doesn't, because it does a much better job of allocating extended or expanded memory in DOS, something a regular boot disk doesn't handle very well. You may even notice the RSS running a bit slower in this mode than with a boot disk or by rebooting through the shut down menu. I beleive this is why it seems to be more RSS friendly than other methods.
Please note I'm NOT telling anyone to run the RSS through a DOS window. I've been somewhat flamed in the past for that because I don't think some people realize this method is just as legit as a boot disk, both do the same thing, one just uses a floppy, the other points the computer to a different set of boot files upon start up. DOS EMULATIONS, both.
Todd
Todd,
DOS 6.22 has three files, two are hidden and that is all most of the RSS that run in DOS needs. So the statement on a boot disk with DOS 6.22 IS valid and the best option. You can add himem.sys and emm386.exe from DOS6.22 if you feel you need memory management on the boot disk.
What is important issue here is the timing and control of the serial port, Win 9X DOES NOT handle the timing correctly or the same way as DOS 6.22 does and that is the reason some RSS will not work on some computers.
WHY TAKE A CHANCE.
DOS 6.22 has three files, two are hidden and that is all most of the RSS that run in DOS needs. So the statement on a boot disk with DOS 6.22 IS valid and the best option. You can add himem.sys and emm386.exe from DOS6.22 if you feel you need memory management on the boot disk.
What is important issue here is the timing and control of the serial port, Win 9X DOES NOT handle the timing correctly or the same way as DOS 6.22 does and that is the reason some RSS will not work on some computers.
WHY TAKE A CHANCE.
Will, You're right, Windows DOES NOT handle the serial port timing correctly. That is why rebooting from the shut down menu (you are actually using the "dosstart.bat" when you do this) is no good. See this link for more info:
http://www.pcforrest.freeserve.co.uk/dosstart_bat.htm
Here's a quick quote from the article:
"By default, the machine will not reboot. Windows is merely unloaded, although certain aspects of the Windows shell remain in force, such as long filename support." - essentially, some aspects of Windows remain, including TSR (Terminate/Stay Resident) programs.
Using the shortcut I mention does not go this route, it actually reboots the machine into DOS using a different procedure the same as a boot disk. There is no part of Windows loaded to cause timing issues.
I never claimed the boot disk wasn't valid, it is! I just stated I've seen my way work when a boot disk didn't, especially with larger RSS which requires 4MB of extended memory to run (MTSX, MCS). Yes, you can modify your Autoexec & config files to do the same, but most people prefer to click something these days.
As far as taking chances, I still promise to send Monty my first corrupted codeplug. I'm somewhere in the area of 7000 radios programmed, on 7 or 8 different computers, with no corruptions yet.
You can quibble over the order, but here's how I see it (processor speed issues aside):
1st: DOS only computer - never a doubt
2nd: DOS only partition - have someone else do it for you if you can't.
3rd: MS-DOS mode for games with EMS & XMS Support.
4th: DOS boot disk (tied for third if you can edit the autoexec & config yourself).
5th: (bad) rebooting from shut down menu or choosing "command prompt only" when booting. - Both essentially Windows without the GUI.
Last: DOS window - This one will turn the radio into a brick, I hope everyone has enough sense not to do it.
My 2 Canadian cents, about .0002 cents American.
Todd
http://www.pcforrest.freeserve.co.uk/dosstart_bat.htm
Here's a quick quote from the article:
"By default, the machine will not reboot. Windows is merely unloaded, although certain aspects of the Windows shell remain in force, such as long filename support." - essentially, some aspects of Windows remain, including TSR (Terminate/Stay Resident) programs.
Using the shortcut I mention does not go this route, it actually reboots the machine into DOS using a different procedure the same as a boot disk. There is no part of Windows loaded to cause timing issues.
I never claimed the boot disk wasn't valid, it is! I just stated I've seen my way work when a boot disk didn't, especially with larger RSS which requires 4MB of extended memory to run (MTSX, MCS). Yes, you can modify your Autoexec & config files to do the same, but most people prefer to click something these days.
As far as taking chances, I still promise to send Monty my first corrupted codeplug. I'm somewhere in the area of 7000 radios programmed, on 7 or 8 different computers, with no corruptions yet.
You can quibble over the order, but here's how I see it (processor speed issues aside):
1st: DOS only computer - never a doubt
2nd: DOS only partition - have someone else do it for you if you can't.
3rd: MS-DOS mode for games with EMS & XMS Support.
4th: DOS boot disk (tied for third if you can edit the autoexec & config yourself).
5th: (bad) rebooting from shut down menu or choosing "command prompt only" when booting. - Both essentially Windows without the GUI.
Last: DOS window - This one will turn the radio into a brick, I hope everyone has enough sense not to do it.
My 2 Canadian cents, about .0002 cents American.
Todd
Hi:
I wanted to add, Todd has a good point
( maybe to sharp ) for the general user,
but what the heck, I still would like to
use my Tecra 510CD to program a " simple "
Maxtrac, and well, it has not been all that
sucessfull.....and its only a P133
Will give his methods a try, perhaps I too
will be able to make these dam Pre-historic
programs fly on a faster plane. ( without crashing of course )
When all else fails, I just rely on the
older 486 Toshiba Laptop ( which I have several of ) just in case one dies.....So far, after years of use, and I too have programmed many a Motorola radio ( others too ) I have been pretty lucky as my Program Platform is pretty stable.
A bit expensive to set up, but its a good
operating table to restore Dead Radios. Maybe
I will just change my nickname to <b><h2><font color= red>Frankin-Tech</b></h2></font>
MS
I wanted to add, Todd has a good point
( maybe to sharp ) for the general user,
but what the heck, I still would like to
use my Tecra 510CD to program a " simple "
Maxtrac, and well, it has not been all that
sucessfull.....and its only a P133
Will give his methods a try, perhaps I too
will be able to make these dam Pre-historic
programs fly on a faster plane. ( without crashing of course )
When all else fails, I just rely on the
older 486 Toshiba Laptop ( which I have several of ) just in case one dies.....So far, after years of use, and I too have programmed many a Motorola radio ( others too ) I have been pretty lucky as my Program Platform is pretty stable.
A bit expensive to set up, but its a good
operating table to restore Dead Radios. Maybe
I will just change my nickname to <b><h2><font color= red>Frankin-Tech</b></h2></font>
MS