Batboard

UPDATED!

9-23-04: I have the site back online. If you encounter problems, please read my reply below (dated 9-23-04) about that.

http://www.CodeplugSupersite.com

~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~

Hello all! After my recent attempt to locate a codeplug from an MTS2000, I came across Jonathan's Codeplug Supersite. I also found a topic where Jonathan decided to stop furthering the site, and he also suggested for someone else to take over. Upon reading this, I decided that it would be a great site that could fill the needs of several Batboard members. So, I gave a quick shot at making a directory site to accomplish this on my SLOW server (130k/690k static DSL).

I would like for many of the members to test the site out, and let me know whether or not I should keep going. Would this be a useful tool in the end? What improvements can be made as well?

Feel free to either PM me, ad a reply here, or email me at [email protected].

Basically, the main directory is filled with folders that have names of the radio model (ie: MTS2000). Inside each radio's directory are folders with the different bands on them (ie: 800). Inside these folders are the codeplugs, which are simply titled by their model numbers. PLEASE ad some more CP's to the site! I only put one MTS2000 CP on there for now as my RSS computer is not networked yet.

Please look over the site and let me know whether I should continue Jonathan's idea, or not.

The Codeplug Supersite: http://64.139.5.180/cgi-bin/ffileman.cgi
Jonathan's thread: http://batboard.batlabs.com/viewtopic.php?t=31963

Looks good to me. We on the board just need to contribute to it, as it is awfully empty right now. I will see about sending what codeplugs I have to you for inclusion in the near future. Gonna' have to add a few new models to your list....

As long as there is no legal problem with it - I'll let someone else answer that question - I think it's a great idea.

If you find the DSL to be too slow for it, I can host it at EnterZone... We've got lotsa bandwidth.

John

is it Mot-only codeplugs?

I think it's a great idea and I'd be happy to contribute. But as John mentioned the legalities of having such a repository should be investigated too.

Would the DMC Act apply here?

In the Motorola software license agreement they seem to refer to codeplug data as “radio profiles data” and they make it clear that they do not want this to be made public.

Nand.

Nand wrote:In the Motorola software license agreement they seem to refer to codeplug data as “radio profiles data” and they make it clear that they do not want this to be made public.

Nand.

The discussion here has mostly been that a codeplug contains your data - your frequency information, etc.

While it does contain motorola's information, it mainly contains your configuration of their product.

I think this can be demonstrated on other levels of products as well, and doesn't just apply to M.

You put your contacts into a cell phone, the contacts are your property, not motorola's, or anyone elses, and they have no rights to that information....

Right/Wrong? Comments?

Edit to add referenced discussion from the past ->

http://batboard.batlabs.com/viewtopic.php?t=511- Read Elroy's post specificly...

http://batboard.batlabs.com/viewtopic.php?t=3124

http://batboard.batlabs.com/viewtopic.php?t=22945

This obviously has been discussed in some detail here in the past.

Ok, after reading the six posts above, and looking at what the poll is currently at (100% yesses), as well as taking into account the list of threads above, I have decided to continue my efforts. I think this would really be a benifiet to our members when they are needing to repair a radio. Does anyone know if Jonathan that had the original Codeplug Supersite had any problems with the legalities of it? If anyone has a copy of an RSS agreement that they can email to me from their RSS program, please do so - I would like to take a look at different ones to see what they say.

As far as the site goes, I will be changing a few things around, such as the URL so it's not "64.139.5.180/ffileman.cgi" - but maybe CPSS.com or CodeplugSupersite.com?

Someone mentioned about needing to add more radios to the list. I only added what I added to get an idea of how it would look. Feel free to ad more to there (ad your CP's too!)

I don't think that people have an issue swapping them - person to person.

I think the issue might come with a large publicly avalible archive of them.

That might be the better question.

I'm not really sure.

-Alex

Right. I see what you mean with that Alex... I am not sure where I would find any information on this - does anyone know? Although, I again want to bring up the original CPSS. As far as I know, there were no issues with it (legally). Only that Jonathan decided that he no longer wanted to run it. Hmmmm...

maybe have the site require you to 'join' and be 'approved' before you're granted access to the code plugs. maybe even have a little disclaimer paragraph to agree to stating that you are authorized to use the material and will do so properly, etc. this might be enough of a difference since the 'general public' isn't allowed to obtain the data. just a thought... trying to think like a lawyer. ok now i feel dirty.

I'd stay clear of the "restricting access" concept.

As well as a legal disclaimer... if you do put on there, make a lawyer write it and make him stand behind his word.

Just a suggestion.

alex wrote:

Nand wrote:In the Motorola software license agreement they seem to refer to codeplug data as “radio profiles data” and they make it clear that they do not want this to be made public.

Nand.

The discussion here has mostly been that a codeplug contains your data - your frequency information, etc.

While it does contain motorola's information, it mainly contains your configuration of their product.

I think this can be demonstrated on other levels of products as well, and doesn't just apply to M.

You put your contacts into a cell phone, the contacts are your property, not motorola's, or anyone elses, and they have no rights to that information....

No doubt Microsoft has little right to the documents I produce with Word or anything else I create with their software. The difference is that the Motorola software license agreement specifically mentions “radio profile data”. Part of it reads as follows:


You may not disclose, transfer or otherwise make available in any form the radio profile data, the Package or any portion thereof, to any person other than your employees, and in the case of the latter, only to the extent necessary for your employees to use the Package in accordance with this licence Agreement.

Remember, this is an agreement that you supposingly signed and agreed with.

Also note that all of the newer codeplugs these days contain a Motorola copyright notice internally.

And last, this is in the Canadian agreement, yours may be different.

Nand.

Nand, I really appriciate your help by providing that excerpt of the agreement. But, being that that is the Canadian version, I would like to see the US version to see if it's the same.

The cgi does include support for a password, but it only supports one. That doesnt mean I couldnt use .htaccess somehow to lock it though (which allows multiple passwords). But yes, this would solve the issue of the site being availble to the general public. On the flip side we would have to either have people sign up and then get a password or post the main password somewhere.

Hmmm....

Mrbmw99 wrote:I would like to see the US version to see if it's the same.

Don't you have a copy that came with your properly licensed RSS?

Victor Xray wrote:

Mrbmw99 wrote:I would like to see the US version to see if it's the same.

Don't you have a copy that came with your properly licensed RSS?

Why, no, he threw it away, just like I did mine (took up too much valuable shelf space!)!

kf4sqb wrote:

Victor Xray wrote:

Mrbmw99 wrote:I would like to see the US version to see if it's the same.

Don't you have a copy that came with your properly licensed RSS?

Why, no, he threw it away, just like I did mine (took up too much valuable shelf space!)!

Of course I did! Shelf and desk space here is definately at a premium!!!


Hmmm... Looking at the CPSS, I only see one CP in there (the one that I put in for testing). I know that maybe others are experiancing what I am (where the RSS system is not networked & no floppy), but I would really like to see a few more CPs in there! I know some of you out here have some on your system that are begging to be thrown on here! C'mon, help us out! Who knows, your computer may crash and you might loose all of your CPs or somethin silly like that , so back them all up on here! Thanks! -BW

One other consideration. Be careful what frequencies and PLs are being posted in these codeplugs. I'm sure ALOT of them are public safety related and in this day and age it would'nt neccesarily be a good thing for them to be floating around. I know the odds are slim that if I were to post, say....some local FD or PD Spectra code plugs on there that someone else locally would find them and abuse them, but that posibility does exist. Just a word of caution.

Mrbmw99 wrote:Hmmm... Looking at the CPSS, I only see one CP in there (the one that I put in for testing). I know that maybe others are experiancing what I am (where the RSS system is not networked & no floppy), but I would really like to see a few more CPs in there! I know some of you out here have some on your system that are begging to be thrown on here! C'mon, help us out! Who knows, your computer may crash and you might loose all of your CPs or somethin silly like that , so back them all up on here! Thanks! -BW

Well, just personally, I am waiting for the legal aspects of the whole thing to be resolved before I upload anything. My programming computer is already networked, as it is a dual-boot system with DOS 6.22 and Windows95, but I am worried about getting in trouble. When the issue is resolved, I will upload a fair number of CPs, for several different models.

I'm with Chuck on this one...

How many of us are with public safety agencies who have done some "tweaking" of the radios... or are plain ole responsible for the radios at their job or volunteer agency. Lot's of us I'm willing to bet. Now if you want to default everything out in your codeplug to post it... great all the better. Enjoy, because at least that way you aren't releasing all your information to the world.

As far as the legality of trading the codeplugs... You can look at it from both Nand's and Alex's point of view. Yes the data in the codeplug for channel ID etc is your own information. But on the other hand... it is stored in a format that is probably some proprietary code that motorola has that could bring it in under the software agreement. Honestly I didn't notice that paragraph in the license agreement I have... but then again I didn't sit and read it word for word either.

In all, I think the codeplug site is a neat idea as long as it's used properly.

I don’t really believe that Motorola has much of a right to the codeplug. I can’t say whether they do or don’t have any right to it. My guess is that they at least have a copyright to the format of it. But that isn’t so much the point here. What is important here is that by signing the agreement, you are now responsible for and limited to what you may or may not do with the codeplug and may suffer the associated penalties for not abiding with this.

You may not disclose, transfer or otherwise make available in any form the radio profile data, the Package or any portion thereof, to any person other than your employees, and in the case of the latter, only to the extent necessary for your employees to use the Package in accordance with this licence Agreement.

In other words, yes, you created it but you agree not to have it used outside your business.

B.T.W. the difference between the American and Canadian agreement may only be the difference in the spelling of the word “Licence” in Canada versus “License” in the USA.

Nand.

Ok. So here's the situation... We are all at a standstill on whether or not the CP site is allowed by motorola, but yet I have not heard of any problems with previous ones. I will be writing an agreement for the site, and users should be required to register. I have not decided yet whether or not to allow users to register and use their own username or to just shoot off the main password and keep it simple, but probably the first option. I have purchased a SIMPLE domain name: CodeplugSupersite.com. It will take a little while for this all to be set up as GoDaddy is a little slow sometimes, but I expect about a day or two... As far as the uploading of CP's go... I would really appriciate it if everyone BLANKS out their codeplugs prior to loading them onto the site. This will stop any issues with giving out information through the CP's (although it is often easily obtained elsewhere ). I will keep you all posted! Thanks for the support! -Brett W

http://www.cps.cmich.edu/~weirmeir/code ... eplugs.zip

That's the entire site, zipped up.

With that, I'm taking my site down.

I hope someone makes something better then I did.

I'm glad if the site helped anyone on the board before.

Mrbmw99 wrote:It will take a little while for this all to be set up as GoDaddy is a little slow sometimes, but I expect about a day or two..

It's not godaddy that's slow, it's Verisign that handles the .com and .net domains. If you register a .us with godaddy it will be ready to use in less time than you can setup the zone files and kick named.

If you need hosting let John or I know and we can get you space.

w7com wrote:

Mrbmw99 wrote:It will take a little while for this all to be set up as GoDaddy is a little slow sometimes, but I expect about a day or two..

It's not godaddy that's slow, it's Verisign that handles the .com and .net domains. If you register a .us with godaddy it will be ready to use in less time than you can setup the zone files and kick named.

If you need hosting let John or I know and we can get you space.

Joe, I really appriciate your offer. At this point, I will simply host it on my server until I get it all figured out OK. I still need to setup the system for the usernames and all and then get the disclaimer all setup properly. Guess what I get to work on tomorrow and Friday? I will be taking a break though this weekend, I'm taking a desperately needed vacation! I will again keep you all posted on this project as it progresses. Have a good one! -BMW

PS: Thanks a bunch Jonathan! I got the zip file with all of the CP's in it, and I will sort though them and post them when I get the system running like it should be...


UPDATE 9.2.04: I got the domain "CodeplugSupersite.com" running up ok. I see that some people have added a few CPs in there already, and I really appriciate that! I will be looking for a fix for this version of software I am using or perhaps a completely different program. Maybe you have noticed, but when you add a folder it messes up how it is all displayed sometimes - thats what I'm referring to. I'm still working on it!

Is it just me or is the http://www.CodeplugSupersite.com super broken ... it keeps refreshing over and over.


Jack

Hi Jack! Actually, I am trying desperately to get this CGI to work properly. It is throwing some weird stuff out when new folders are added. I am working on it still, but I guess I should throw it back up for now until then. Yeah, I'll do that right now - it should be up in a few minutes.... Thanks though! -BW

EDIT: I got the site up and running with a different version of the CGI. It is an older revision, so there is no DL capabilities on it - only browsing and uploading. I will try to fix this tomorrow night when I come home from work, we'll see what happens! Sorry about this though, I guess that CGI simply isnt getting along with my system... -BW

I was just at the site and sorta jumped around in it trying to see what the code plug would be displayed like and so forth.

But didnt find any code plug at all = Im assuning its empty as of yet ?

Or did i miss one that i could have looked at ?

EKLB

The person setting up the codeplus site needs to file batlabs as a buisness with big M so we can be all employee's and then they can transfer them between your buisness employee's only. If need be, set it up for batlabs only.


CHART

Brett, did you get the zip of plugs I sent you?

CHART: I wish! I am going to secure the site using a password and username, which will be created by a user with their own username (If all works out OK). The link to the page to do this will only be posted here.

Woody: Nope. Where did you send them to? I'm at [email protected]...

Everyone: I am STILL looking to find a CGI that will work GREAT for this appliction. I really liked the one that I had, but it has issues when running on my server. I guess for the next few days the site will not be working as it should. Until then, feel free to mess around or sumthing. The username is: batlabs and the password is: cpss if you would like to see whatever is there right now. I am sorry for this delay, I am extremely busy between school and work, but I have tomorrow off so we'll see what happens! -BW

Sent again....

Got em! Thanks!

Since the legality question is a serious one, might I suggest that until it can be resolved, that the site remain operational to upload only. Sort of donating to the library until it can open. This way, if and when the decision is made to allow downloading, there'll (hopefully) be a substantial inventory of CPs.

As to the legality question, I tend to believe that if M really doesn't approve, their first course of action would be to simply send a cease and desist letter to the registered administrator of the site. At that point, shut it down.

Oh, and I whole heartedly agree with Jaymz about uploading codeplugs with the factory default values only. In fact, doesn't each copy of software have a set of default CPs for each band the RSS covers?

Henry

PRR wrote:
Oh, and I whole heartedly agree with Jaymz about uploading codeplugs with the factory default values only. In fact, doesn't each copy of software have a set of default CPs for each band the RSS covers?

Henry

Some RSS packages do have sample code plugs with them; most do not. But it brings up an interesting point. If the RSS did come with sample code plugs, why would there be a need for posting these unless the RSS wasn’t obtained the proper way?

Nand.

Hello.

I was working on a project to allow a /\/\ radio to be reprogrammed by the user.
The beta works quite well thank you.
The trouble is several fold, including the FCC.
It would seem that you COULD get into trouble by making use of a GP68, in the ham bands.
The issue is one of the software in the GP68, and type approval by the FCC.
So, if /\/\ can get upset over hams and 3rd world radios, just think what MIGHT happen with a front-line product.

Nand wrote:

Some RSS packages do have sample code plugs with them; most do not. But it brings up an interesting point. If the RSS did come with sample code plugs, why would there be a need for posting these unless the RSS wasn’t obtained the proper way?

I was thinking of the codeplug values in a new, in-the-box radio as delivered to the dealer from Motorola. But that may not work either as those values are "written" by M at the factory and would most likely be covered under any software license stipulations.

Maybe what would be needed is a set of default, (safe and harmless) Batlabs values for uploaded codeplugs. Some select Batlabs members who possess legitimate copies of the various software packages could be assigned as moderators to check each uploaded codeplug, assign the default values if necessary, then make them available for download.

Henry

Now your cookin .

I like the idea of a code plug being sent to a moderator then up loaded to the site.

This would greatly improved the detailed info of a code plug with details of exactly what it was.

Things like for example a Generic Title of GP300 VHF doesnt tell everthing that we may want to know.

How about GP300 VHF /8ch /5watt/136 to 162 split /with DTMF
Or GP300 VHF /8ch /5watt / 142 to 174 split / no DTMF

I only mention the wattage as an example here because for example a P110 was available in 2 watt and the high power 5watt versions and one might want the exact code plug to match the wattage output otherwise the model number will not agree with the radio and Presto error #21 code.

Also the Maxtrac is availble in various wattage outputs as well
(25 watt versus 45 watts as an example)

Things like was the code plug from a Maxtrac with a 5 pin logic bd or was it a 16 pin logic bd may prove to be useful to some of us into the experimenting side of things too.

I realize this is getting rather detailed but why not make the site the best that ever came along and cant be beat or improved because it came out a winner from the start.

Im in full suport of this idea and hope it does extremely well.

EKLB

How do I get a password and user id for the super site?



SD70MAC OUT

SD70MAC wrote:How do I get a password and user id for the super site?



SD70MAC OUT

You read the thread

Mrbmw99 wrote:Until then, feel free to mess around or sumthing. The username is: batlabs and the password is: cpss if you would like to see whatever is there right now.

Here's an update to the project!

As of Sept 23, 2004, I have to site up and online. It is NOT finished, but for many different reasons. But due to the fact that I have had it messed up for a while now, I decided to put up what I have so far. SO, this means that the site should be fully functional, but users may encounter a problem here and there. If anyone does come across a problem, please notify me! I would like a description of the problem, and what I should do to recreate it. These can be sent to me at: [email protected].

The username and passwords are as follows:
Username: batlabs
Password: cpss

Here's a link for your convienience: http://www.CodeplugSupersite.com

Upload and Download away! -Brett W

Cowthief wrote:Hello.

I was working on a project to allow a /\/\ radio to be reprogrammed by the user.
The beta works quite well thank you.
The trouble is several fold, including the FCC.
It would seem that you COULD get into trouble by making use of a GP68, in the ham bands.
The issue is one of the software in the GP68, and type approval by the FCC.
So, if /\/\ can get upset over hams and 3rd world radios, just think what MIGHT happen with a front-line product.

my god, don't you get tired of this?