FRS and Interational Law

RADIOMAN2002 · Post by **RADIOMAN2002** » Wed Jul 10, 2002 2:44 pm

My wife and son are going to Japan soon, and would like to use FRS radios. Are FRS radios legal outside the USA, or is that frequency band something different over there.
JSD

techie · Post by **techie** » Wed Jul 10, 2002 3:14 pm

FRS is a US only allocation. (possibly canada/mexico as well, but don't quote me on that.)

Josh · Post by **Josh** » Wed Jul 10, 2002 4:21 pm

FRS is legal only in the United States of America and Canada.

GMRS is only legal in the United states and require a license

(be sure you know which you have- some GMRS toys look just like and are sold the same way as FRS).

I don't think the Japan has their own license free radios there. I know that Europe has PMR-446, and Australia has a UHF CB service, but I don't know about Asia. My advice it to leave the FRS's at home.

-Josh
WPTP753

MT2000 man · Post by **MT2000 man** » Wed Jul 10, 2002 6:14 pm

Besides, how do you expect to hear your wife and son from Japan, to the U.S. (if you're staying in the U.S.) ?

LOL

(had to say it

RadioSouth · Post by **RadioSouth** » Wed Jul 10, 2002 7:06 pm

Good idea to leave them home, Japanese customs might seize them.

RESCUE161 · Post by **RESCUE161** » Thu Jul 11, 2002 8:12 am

When I went to Japan I had my HAM radios. They kept ensuring me that 'CB's were illegal in Japan. I kept insisting that they were not CBs and showed them my license. They finally let me through customs, but I had to get a reciprocate license... It cost about $120.00 U.S. back in 1993...
Scott
KE4FHH
"AKA" 7J6CDD

RFdude · Post by **RFdude** » Thu Jul 11, 2002 7:59 pm

The world is divided into three International Telecommunications Union (ITU) regions. North America is region 2. The public band starts at 450 MHz and goes up, while amateur radio is 430 to 450 MHz.

Early on after Motorola introduced FRS, some USA ebay vendors were selling FRS radios that were intended for Europe. Trouble is, Europe is a different ITU region where the public band starts at 440 MHz and goes up from there. European FRS radios operate around 446 MHz, which is the AMATEUR RADIO BAND in region 2. Needless to say it's operation without an amateur radio license is illegal in this case in North America.

Don't take any chances. Don't buy the Japanese FRS radios unless you plan on using them there and giving them away or selling before you leave.

Jonathan KC8RYW · Post by **Jonathan KC8RYW** » Thu Jul 11, 2002 8:09 pm

RFdude wrote: Early on after Motorola introduced FRS, some USA ebay vendors were selling FRS radios that were intended for Europe. Trouble is, Europe is a different ITU region where the public band starts at 440 MHz and goes up from there. European FRS radios operate around 446 MHz, which is the AMATEUR RADIO BAND in region 2. Needless to say it's operation without an amateur radio license is illegal in this case in North America.

SWEET! I'd like to get my hands on one of those!

Josh · Post by **Josh** » Thu Jul 11, 2002 8:59 pm

KC8RYW wrote:

SWEET! I'd like to get my hands on one of those![/quote]

It isn't hard. The radios are marketed under 'PMR-446'. These radios are available on eBay.

-Josh

Jonathan KC8RYW · Post by **Jonathan KC8RYW** » Fri Jul 12, 2002 4:37 am

Josh wrote:
KC8RYW wrote: SWEET! I'd like to get my hands on one of those!
It isn't hard. The radios are marketed under 'PMR-446'. These radios are available on eBay.

-Josh

Hmm... looks like FRS... has the same power output as FRS... about the same band as FRS... costs about the same as FRS... But It's Not FRS.

It's PMR-446.

Intresting. I think the only real difference is frequency. I've read about some /\/\ PMR-446 mini-HT's having a voice scrambling capability. It's probably simple inversion. I don't recall seeing scrambling on domestic FRS gear.

How handy is that? It's even right in the 70cm simplex band-plan.
Neat. I could see some use for these at a hamfest, keeping in touch with a buddy, while keeping the "real" HT free.

Post by **alex** » Fri Jul 12, 2002 5:24 am

I've seen voice inversion scrambling on the Kenwood UBZ-LF14's back when I had a pair in 1998 before people started buying them like hot cakes.

-Alex

Tom in D.C. · Post by **Tom in D.C.** » Fri Jul 12, 2002 8:57 am

Several PMR446 radios are now listed on eBay, all in the UK if anyone wants to pay the freight. Cheap, too.

Tom, W2NJS
...in D.C.

Jonathan KC8RYW · Post by **Jonathan KC8RYW** » Fri Jul 12, 2002 11:54 am

Very Interesting.

Check out the Alinco DJ-446 PMR-446 HT. http://www.rigpix.com/lpdmm/alinco_dj446.htm

Looks familiar, does it!? It looks just like the DJ-493 HT, which was the smaller brother of the popular DJ-496 ham HT!

What is more, the DJ-446 can be mod'ed from 500mW to 5W (or 4W on battery.)

http://www.mods.dk/mods.php3?radio=alin ... =2334#2334

I wonder if the DJ-446 can be moded into a DJ-493?

Anyone on this board live in the UK?

Let's talk.

RadioSouth · Post by **RadioSouth** » Fri Jul 12, 2002 2:52 pm

Anyone ever have their non type accepted transceiver snagged by Customs when attempted to be brought into the US ? These PMR radios
seem interesting but will they make it here without a problem ? Reason
I ask is I know someone years ago that was bringing a shipment of GP68's
in and they had a Custom's problem (no FCC ID# on the label).

Josh · Post by **Josh** » Fri Jul 12, 2002 4:15 pm

FRS and all cheap-o 'scrambling' is voice inversion.

It comes on many FRS radios made by Motorola: the T6220, T6400, T7100 and T7200 (the T7200 is a GMRS and FRS radio that also does repeaters on the band- even in scrambled mode)

They're everywhere. Cobra also makes scrambling FRS radios I used to own one of those, too- the microtalk II

-Josh

Jonathan KC8RYW · Post by **Jonathan KC8RYW** » Fri Jul 12, 2002 6:20 pm

RadioSouth wrote:Anyone ever have their non type accepted transceiver snagged by Customs when attempted to be brought into the US ? These PMR radios
seem interesting but will they make it here without a problem ? Reason
I ask is I know someone years ago that was bringing a shipment of GP68's
in and they had a Custom's problem (no FCC ID# on the label).

I don't see why this would be a problem. Ham equipment does not need FCC approval. As long as I wasn't selling this stuff out of the ham bands, it shouldn't matter.

However, selling non-FCC cert. 2-ways for the commercial band is just asking for trouble. Not only from the law, but also a lawsuit from ma'/\/\. I remember hearing about one a few years back in Miami. Not a pretty situation.

I'll have to research this, though.

Josh wrote:FRS and all cheap-o 'scrambling' is voice inversion.

It comes on many FRS radios made by Motorola: the T6220, T6400, T7100 and T7200 (the T7200 is a GMRS and FRS radio that also does repeaters on the band- even in scrambled mode)

They're everywhere. Cobra also makes scrambling FRS radios I used to own one of those, too- the microtalk II

-Josh

I wasn't aware of this. Probably because when I see the phrase FRS, I stop paying attention all together.

I think it is pretty bad when little kids talking to each other on FRS can use encryption, and hams can't. Sigh.

RadioSouth · Post by **RadioSouth** » Fri Jul 12, 2002 7:55 pm

Hams can homebrew their own equipment and not need type acceptance as you mention but does this same exemption apply to commercially manuf. ham rigs ? Just took a look at my Yaesu FT-2500M and it does have an FCC ID label. From the conversation the guy with the GP-68's had with Custom's he was told any transmitter without a FCC ID# was contraband from an importation standpoint. I had been told early run
GP68's did have FCC ID# labels on them but Motorola discontinued putting
these labels on GP68's when many were finding their way into the US and
the lack of this label was supposed to prevent these radios from making
it past US Customs.

hycheng · Post by **hycheng** » Fri Jul 12, 2002 11:40 pm

A good reference on international frequencies allocations

http://www.geocities.com/rf-man/handheld.html

FRS and Interational Law

FRS and Interational Law

ITU region

Re: ITU region

Re: ITU region

Re: ITU region

PMR446 radios...

Interesting Observation

international frequencies